Dinesh D'Souza on Freedom of Thought, and "Trump Card: Beating Socialism, Corruption and the Deep State"

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Podcasting from Fifthtis, Tennessee. He's
a soldier, a storyteller, historians,

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and maybe a mine of a hell
raiser. Click listen and enjoy. It's

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Dave Carter on the Ricochet Audio Networks. Welcome to the program, folks.

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Delighted to have you on board today. I'm your tour guide Dave Carter,

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and we'll be making some fascinating stops
in our little obscursion today. Author and

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filmmaker Denise de Suza will be along
in just a minute, and we've got

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Ricochet member Jenna Stalker in the lineup
as well, and it's always a treat

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to hear from her. Meanwhile,
that light at the end of the tunnel

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is not a train. It's the
fast approaching election, which gives us to

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either a chance to affirm the concept
of limited government, separation of powers,

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and essentially a government that exists to
protect the rights enumerated in the Bill of

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Rights. I either right to free
speech, the right to worship and practice

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one's faith, the right to self
defense or the right to property, the

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right equal treatment before the wall,
or we affirm the idea that the federal

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government is actually Santa Claus Uncle Sugar. If you will who will give us

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free education, free healthcare, free
whatever we want, someone else is going

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to pay for it. If you
believe that, then P. T.

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Barnum was actually underestimating our globability.
We either think of ourselves as free and

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sovereign individuals or as wards of the
state, dependent on a government that forces

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us to work in labor on the
palf of others. That idea doesn't work.

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It's never worked. To just look
at Venezuela and that's what the other

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side offers. But that's just my
take on it. So let's get down

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to the business, shall we.
It was twenty nine years ago that I

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watched a two hour of firing Line
debate featuring way Met Buckley Junior and a

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collection of scholars and intellectuals who debated
the proposition that freedom of thought is in

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danger on American campuses. And that
was my first exposure to my guest,

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TONSA. Susa, who, at
that time it just published a groundbreaking book

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titled Illiberal Education. Originally from Mumbai, India, mister D. Susa came

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to American nineteen seventy eight and graduated
from Dartmouth in teen eighty three, and

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while at Dartmouth. He founded the
Dartmouth Review. Here's a policy advisor to

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President Ronald Reagan, and he went
on to author fifteen nationally renowned books,

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many of them becoming number one New
York Times bestsellers. He's a scholar,

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prominent intellectuals in great demand one college
campuses, and if that wasn't enough to

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keep several people busy, Denish is
also an award wilming filmmaker. Two of

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his films, twenty sixteen Obama's America
and America Imagine the World Without Her Or

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the number two and number six highest
ranked political documentaries of all time. He

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served as the John immoln Fellow at
the American Enterprise Institute, and The New

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York Times magazine listed him as one
of America's most influential conservative thinkers. His

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work has appeared all over the place, and I could sit here the rest

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of the day and rattle this stuff
off, but I just want to get

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to talk to him. One one
crucial point, though, Wikipedia described him

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as a provocateur, which tells me
that he must be doing something right.

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And it's the privilege, indeed,
to welcome him to the services to day,

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Denis, how are you sir,
hey, I'm doing great. Thanks

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for having me on the show.
It's a life. Thank you so much

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for taking time to talk with us. And I understand that you've got a

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brand new film literally just came out
and it's already number one on iTunes and

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amazons that correct. Yes, it's
called trump Card. And my earlier films

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have all been released in the theater, but with this, with the theatrical

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picture a little bit uneven, he
decided to release this one straight to video

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on demand, so you can buy
a physical DVD, or of course you

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can watch it on iTunes or Google
or YouTube or a whole bunch of platforms.

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And if I may say, the
website is just trump Card themovie dot

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com. That's how to find it. And I've seen it and it is

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stellar. It is awesome enough.
We'll get to that in just a moment,

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but with your kind indulgence, I
want to set the stage a little

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bit as to how we got here
in the first place, and I'm going

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to do some time travel back twenty
nine years ago to that fine line debate

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on a freedom of thought in American
college campuses and a comment that you made.

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It was during a particulars change.
You noted that the prime movers and

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instigators are political correctness speech codes,
that kind of thing. We're not a

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numerical majority, but that they made
themselves out to be a moral majority.

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And you said, quote they exercise
a kind of moral leverage, and they're

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quick to brand any kind of opposition
is being ten amount to bigotry unquote.

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So my question is number one,
that's like nosredomis. I mean, you

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nailed it, But my question is, since you spent so much time on

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college campuses, how have things changed
in thirty years or the radical element still

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a numerical minority for example, Yes, the radicalism has gotten I think far

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worse on the college campus. My
daughter is actually in her mid twenty she

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graduated from Dartmouth as I did.
So it's almost like that, so before

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and after a snapshot of what that
college is like. And the bottom line

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of it is, when I was
a student, the college leaned left,

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but there was debate. There were
conservative professors on campus. You could actually

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hear rival in alternative points of view. Now that seems to have been extinguished

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through a large degree, and these
colleges have become indoctrination factories. I think

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the second big and important change is
that the craziness of the campus has now

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made its way to the street.
I sometimes say that academia is the theory

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and Antifa is the practice, Okay, And what I mean is that the

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crazy doctrines of the campus are exactly
behind the people who are now knocking down

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monuments, raiding historical societies, attacking
the statue of Abraham Lincoln, burning things,

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setting breaking windows, and pulling people
out of cars. M Okay,

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Now, I'm not asking you necesses
a daunting picture that you get you paint.

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I'm not asking you to act as
my therapist. But maybe I am.

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But anyway, I am I being
overly pessimistic when I posit that the

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cultural intellectual decline, that, for
example, Professor Alban Bloomage outlined in his

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book The Closing the American Mind has
metastasize of the point that it afflicts absolutely

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every aspect of American education, entertainment, and popular culture. Yeah. The

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problem is that the progressives have taken
over and they have become very intolerant about

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any points of view that run against
them. Far from welcoming debate, they

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hate it because they are unable to
see their intellectual critics as being well meaning

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adversaries. They see them as political
enemies that need to be quote sort of

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dealt with. And this is the
mentality behind saying, let's get people thrown

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off a digital platform, Let's get
them fired from their job, let's get

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them kicked out of Hollywood. Let's
make sure this young academic never gets tenure.

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There's a kind of you know,
or Well predicted this. He predicted

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that all forms of socialism, even
democratic socialism, pushing the direction of tyranny.

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And so we're beginning to see in
this country the first whiff of what

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could be a very tyrannical and depressing
future. You said recently in an interview

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that I saw you said that the
radicalization of the left has radicalized you in

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some sense as well. How's that
well. I used to have a civics

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book, Idea of American Politics.
I thought it was essentially a gentleman's debate

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between two sides that agreed about goals
but disagreed about means. I thought that

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all Americans agree, we want to
be a strong country, we want to

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be ospress, we want to be
an example to the world. Now we

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might disagree about how the great American
prosperity pie should be exactly shared. And

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so there's a legitimate question about that. But I never doubted the idea that

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ultimately this is sort of two rival
views that we put before the American people.

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But when I had my case with
the Obama administration a few years ago,

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I realized that the left had become
gangsterized. I saw it with my

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own eyes, and now, of
course Michael Flynn has seen it, George

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Popadopolis, Carter Page, and even
Trump himself. So clearly the gangsterization of

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the Democratic left has proceeded very far. It's a long way from the sort

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of nincompoopery of Jimmy Carter to the
sheer malevolence of the Clintons and Barack Obama.

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Well, a couple days ago,
I think it was Keith Olberman gave

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us a pretty chilling preview when he
said, even Amy Coney, Barrett and

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just about everyone that backs her or
the president needs to be criminalized and locked

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up. Yeah. I was actually
quite shocked by the violence of that address,

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of the use of language too.
First of all, he's talking about

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it's one thing to say, you
know, Trump has committed high crimes and

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misdemeanors, or that there have been
people who have violated the law. But

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to say that Sean Hannity and Amy
Coney Barrett should be arrested, I mean

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this is a kind that this is
what the fascist did. And he also

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used fascist language. I mean he
used language like maggots. You'd have to

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go back to Germany in the thirties, where the Nazis called Jews insects and

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maggots. I remember Gebbels was once
asked something like, wouldn't you admit that

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the Jews human being? And Gerbel
said, well, a flea is an

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animal, but what kind of an
animal? So the point of using this

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kind of Olberman language is essentially to
suggest that these people should be exterminated,

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because why call someone a maggot?
What do you do with a maggot if

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not calling pest control and exterminate it. So you do humanize them first,

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and then then off we go from
there exactly. That brings us around to

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your new film Drop Card Beating Socialism, Corruption and the Deep State, in

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which you document the radicalization of the
left and the things they have in store.

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And you don't just make assertions in
the movie again I've seen it.

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You take us with you as you
do the research, as you conduct first

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person interviews, and you provide and
exposed primary sources. Correct. Absolutely,

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I mean the movies are well.
This movie is based on my book United

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States of Socialism, which is very
thoroughly researched. But a book is different

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than a movie. A book lays
out an argument, a book supplies references.

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A movie is an emotional narrative.
It's ultimately an entertainment. And this

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is a very riveting movie. It's
fun to watch. I hope you'll agree,

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and it's sort of horrifying in parts, frightening maybe in parts, but

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in the end it's also very inspirational
and motivational. Well, the history,

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as you pointed out, of the
socialist movement, of the totalitary movement is

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oftentimes rather frightening, isn't it.
So it's good due to put that on

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the film so people can understand what
is going on here and how high the

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stakes actually are. Absolutely. My
wife's from Venezuela, and when Huba Chavez

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came to power in Venezuela, he
denied he was a socialist, he said

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he was kind of a sent and
in fact it took him some years before

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he started the Socialist Party of Venezuela. But slowly this kind of prosperous country

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that had a two party system,
a democratic form of government, slowly began

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to collapse. So not only economic
collapse, but the emergence of thuggery on

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the street, of crime, of
tyranny, of going after political dissidence.

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All the things that we see the
first signs of in America today are now

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far advanced in Venezuela. So to
me, that's the direction we're headed,

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not to Scandinavia or Stockholm, but
rather to Venezuela and Caracas. And you

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point out in the film The Left
Love Affair with hugoshav Is and with the

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Venezuela model before it degenerated, people
eating out of dumpsters. Yeah, it's

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very very illuminating where people do their
political tourism. So even though Bernie Sanders

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says something like I believe in the
veness I believe in the Scandinavian model,

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Bernie Sanders has never been to Scandinavia, even though by the way you spart

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Scandinavian O. But he honeymooned in
Moscow. And you know, Michael Moore

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went to Cuba to demonstrate the wonders
of Cuban healthcare. A lot of Hollywood

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actors have gone to Venezuela, So
it shows you that that's the kind of

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socialism they like. So for people
who not necessarily on yours and my side

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of the political leisure, what is
it that when they see this film that

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you'd like them to take away from
it, Well, I would riage any

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American to watch it in an open
minded way. It doesn't matter what side

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you're on, because the film tells
the story, and it tells the story

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by supplying you can see it for
yourself. It's a show, not tell

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and so as a result, you
could really make up your own mind.

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You could see if this is the
America that you want. You know you

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can. There's a big debate about
is Biden really a socialist or is he

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a socialist light? But if you
think of the free market at one end

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of the spectrum and socialism at the
other, just ask yourself a simple question

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in what direction are the Democrats pulling? And the simple answer is that every

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Democrat, whether it's Elizabeth Warren,
Nancy Pelosi, Chuck Schumer, or Joe

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Biden, they're all pulling in the
socialist direction. Right. We keep hearing

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that the polls are lining up against
the president, but the polls were famously

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wrong in twenty sixteen. So what's
your sense of whether or not we can

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believe the polls this time around.
How's that shaping up in your mind?

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Well, I confess this is not
my area of I shall be. I'm

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not not good at reading the tea
leaves, per se. I focus really

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more on the issues, okay,
But I also have an instinct about the

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good sense of the American people.
I think the media bias is more transparent

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than ever. Biden is obviously a
ridiculous candidate. It's hard for me to

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believe that any American with common sense
would say that this kind of absurd man

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who barely knows how to even if
he knows his middle name, if this

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is the kind of guy who can
be at the steward of a great country.

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Yeah, Umthor dedom will reduced this
next question. But I had Victor

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Davis Hanson on my show recently,
and he suggested that the president in the

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election ought to refrain from making this
a left versus right referendum or a Democrat

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versus a Republican contest and instead Frameman
in terms of class, he refers to

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the skype or the zoom class,
who many whom sit behind their computers and

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feel organically suited to run the lives
of other folks, and then what he

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calls a muscular class, to folks
are on the lines driving freight across the

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country, the first responders, those
kind of folks. Do you think that

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would be a good advice for the
president to follow? Said? I think

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that another way to look at it
is that the Democratic Party has now become

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the party of the rich. The
Republicans have traditionally been portrayed that way into

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some degree, was true, but
Democrats now the richest people in America support

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the Democratic Party. A lot of
big corporations of funneling money not just through

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the Democratic Party, they're giving money
to Antifa and Black Lives Matter. So

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I think Republicans need to realize that
we are now the party of the middle

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class and the working class, and
that's not a bad thing. That's actually

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the long term future of the Republican
Party. And whatever happens at this election,

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I'm very optimistic Trump will pull it
off. Yeah, I think the

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consequences are going to be amazing.
But whatever happens in the election, that

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kind of platform, that kind of
populous conservatism might think is the road to

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success in the future. Okay,
I'm gonna ask a question of you that

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I've asked to several folks. You
recall in twenty sixteen that people called it

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the Flight ninety three election, where
if we didn't get it right that all

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may be lost. Right? Did
you believe that the same sort of thing

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applies, That the stakes are so
high in this election that if we don't

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get it right we may very well
not recover. I think that, but

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I like to spell it out because
it's so you know, when people say

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it's the most important election of our
lifetime, that has a familiar ring to

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it. I think that if Trump
loses, there will be an effort to

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demonize the Trump phenomenon, to demonize
all the Trump stir is, the people

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associated with Trump sure to make this
seem like a regrettable stain on American life

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that should never be allowed to happen
again. By contrast, if Trump wins,

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I think we could see not just
policy change and political change and change

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in the courts, but cultural change. Trump comes out of the sort of

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the mainstream of American culture, the
world of television and the Apprentice. Here's

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a guy who recognize this is the
importance of culture, because I think that's

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how battle ahead long term. Whatever
happens in the election, the Left will

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still control the universities, they'll still
control the media, they'll still control Hollywood,

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and we can't let that go uncontested, because ultimately, it's not just

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about this election. It affects every
election. And you seem to have made

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it your life's work not to let
that go uncontested. And this is my

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last question, But you and I
are about the same age. Very close.

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You came to American seventy eight.
I gathered that you went almost immediately

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and began a lifetime's devotion to public
policies. That fair enough. Well,

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for the first couple of years,
I frankly didn't know anything about American politics.

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I think I caught the Reagan bug
in at Dartmouth in the nineteen eighties.

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I became very interested in politics.
I joined a group of sort of

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a band of conservative renegade. So
yes, by the time I graduated from

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college, I realized I began to
understand better what it was I liked about

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America. It wasn't so much that
I became a conservative, But once I

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became familiar with conservative ideas and beliefs, I realized that's what I always was.

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When you came to realize conservative ideas
and beliefs, is that when you

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00:16:06.159 --> 00:16:10.039
saw I assume that they're under attack
even back then, Is that what stirred

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00:16:10.039 --> 00:16:14.200
in you this interest to devote a
lifetime to great matters of public debate.

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00:16:14.559 --> 00:16:18.080
Yeah, very simply. I've enjoyed
the benefits of the American dream, and

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now that words not just ladders of
opportunity, but the chance to sort of

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be the architect of my own destiny. I don't think that that's possible in

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many places in the world, if
any, outside of America. So I

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came to appreciate what it is about
America that gave me the kind of life

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that I've enjoyed so much, and
I thought, well, wow, I

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really need to defend the sort of
infrastructure that has made that possible so that

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my daughter and other generations could also
enjoy those same dreams and live in a

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free country. Awesome, folks.
The movie is called Trump Card Beating Socialism,

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Corruption in the Deep state. I've
seen it. It's an ultra high

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00:16:51.639 --> 00:16:56.759
definition presentation of the people on both
sides of the political divide today. It's

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00:16:56.799 --> 00:16:59.840
fact based, and it's researched and
sourced right in front of your eyes on

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00:16:59.879 --> 00:17:03.080
the screens. So bring your predispositions
and questions with you and see how they

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stand up to reality. Denish you
said, folks can do download this as

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00:17:07.359 --> 00:17:10.519
well. Order didn't get the seat
a DVD? Right? Yes, Trump

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00:17:10.599 --> 00:17:14.160
card themovie dot com. That's a
good place to order the DVD for friends,

260
00:17:14.359 --> 00:17:17.039
or watch the movie by video download, and you can watch it on

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00:17:17.079 --> 00:17:19.880
any platform. I prefer people watch
it on a big screen TV because it

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was made for the big screen,
but hey, if you want to watch

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it on your phone or a computer, you can do that too. Whatever

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works out. And I think,
if I'm not, if I'm not mistaken,

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your daughter's got a book out too, right, My daughter Danielle has

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a new book out. It's called
The Choice, the Abortion Divide in America.

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00:17:34.200 --> 00:17:37.680
It could not be more timely because
of all this craziness going on around

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the court. A lot of that
is about one single issue will roll versus

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weight be overturned. So you should
have her on your show, and your

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00:17:45.279 --> 00:17:48.680
listeners should check out her book.
Fantastic. There's been a treat and a

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privilege talking to you after all these
years. This is this is awesome.

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Perhaps we can check in with you
after the election and do an assessment with

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Will happy to do it. All
right, Thanks taking time to talk with

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a sir. Take care, folks, as Denish to SUSA on the Dave

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Carter program, because what this country
needs is more free speech worth listening to.

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It's Dave Carter on Ricochet. All
right, So what do you think

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00:18:26.960 --> 00:18:30.240
of Denish to SUSA. You know, when I first I first saw him

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on Fine Line in nineteen ninety one, I mean he looked like he was

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00:18:33.799 --> 00:18:37.160
twelve years old, but he was
a suburb debater, a great writer,

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00:18:37.279 --> 00:18:41.279
a great researcher, and wise beyond
his year. Is very very impressive gentleman,

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00:18:41.680 --> 00:18:44.480
and he's an inspiration given the amount
of energy he devotes to so many

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projects simultaneously. In this latest movie
is simply outstanding. I urge you to

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00:18:48.200 --> 00:18:51.240
watch it. In fact, for
some of you, I dare you to

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00:18:51.279 --> 00:18:53.440
watch it see the facts for yourselves. I think you'd be impressed. The

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00:18:53.519 --> 00:18:56.759
Jenna Stalker will be along in just
a moment. But first, hey,

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00:18:56.799 --> 00:19:00.440
you enjoyed the show today. You
enjoy the various podcast on the Ricochet Audio

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00:19:00.440 --> 00:19:04.920
Network, from Andrew Cleveland Show to
Commentary magazine show to the Flagship podcast and

288
00:19:06.039 --> 00:19:08.799
so much more. There's something here
for everyone now. As a rule,

289
00:19:08.839 --> 00:19:11.279
if you want to comment on the
podcast post, or comment on the main

290
00:19:11.319 --> 00:19:17.559
feed post, or read and comment
on post on the member's side only side

291
00:19:17.599 --> 00:19:19.319
of the house behind the paywall,
well that's going to run you four and

292
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a half bucks a month. And
if you spend just fifty cents more a

293
00:19:22.759 --> 00:19:26.119
month, then you can write and
publish your own articles on Ricochet and let

294
00:19:26.160 --> 00:19:27.920
the whole wide world see what do
you think about things? Now, here's

295
00:19:27.920 --> 00:19:32.319
an idea. Let's say you're not
sure about all that and you don't want

296
00:19:32.359 --> 00:19:34.119
to spend four to five bucks to
find out, all right, So here's

297
00:19:34.240 --> 00:19:37.400
here's what we've done for the listeners
to this program. Just go to ricochet

298
00:19:37.400 --> 00:19:41.680
dot com slash gumbo to sign at
kit Ma Louisiana. That's what we go

299
00:19:41.720 --> 00:19:45.599
with around here, ricochet dot com
slash gumbo. You get a free thirty

300
00:19:45.640 --> 00:19:48.200
day trial in Ricochet. All right, you can take a look kick the

301
00:19:48.200 --> 00:19:52.000
tires. Do whatever you want,
crash the thing, it doesn't matter.

302
00:19:52.240 --> 00:19:55.559
Then after thirty days, if you
want to continue your membership, then four

303
00:19:55.559 --> 00:19:57.559
and a half bucks gets here in
the door. Sound all right, of

304
00:19:57.599 --> 00:20:00.400
course it does. They're just heading
over to Rick Say dot com slash Gumbo.

305
00:20:00.519 --> 00:20:19.079
That's g u Mbo, and you
can join the conversation that the best

306
00:20:19.160 --> 00:20:30.519
DJ in the world probably that's a
gorgeous day here at mids Tennessee. Folks.

307
00:20:30.119 --> 00:20:33.559
You know, here's Ago that used
to say that what distinguished the the

308
00:20:33.559 --> 00:20:37.079
best DJ's actually from the rest of
the herd was the fact that that the

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00:20:37.160 --> 00:20:41.599
best DJ's didn't talk over the music. Have you got some good guitar RiPP

310
00:20:41.640 --> 00:20:48.240
that you like, We'll tell you
won't stop lapping his gums. I hate

311
00:20:48.279 --> 00:21:04.880
that, all right, Okay,
so I'd made it. I really don't

312
00:21:04.920 --> 00:21:10.359
have any excuse from my behavior here
this morning. But it's fun. I

313
00:21:10.400 --> 00:21:14.200
mean, we talk about serious matters
all the time, right, existentially serious

314
00:21:14.200 --> 00:21:15.759
matters. That doesn't mean we can't
have a good time and grin every now

315
00:21:15.799 --> 00:21:22.160
that and enjoy the enjoy the moment
or whatever. Well, joining me now

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00:21:22.400 --> 00:21:25.960
is someone that's becoming something of a
regular here. Jenna stalkers with us from

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00:21:25.960 --> 00:21:30.519
Minneapolis, which a few months ago
looked like Hiroshia after Truman got through with

318
00:21:30.559 --> 00:21:33.519
it. But Jenna is a prolific
writer on Ricochet, one of the best

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00:21:33.519 --> 00:21:37.440
writers on the site if you ask
me, and she's a she's in the

320
00:21:37.480 --> 00:21:41.519
Marine Corps veteran. And Jenna,
when when were you in the Marine Corps?

321
00:21:42.920 --> 00:21:52.160
So it was two thousand seven to
eleven, I think about it.

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00:21:52.079 --> 00:21:56.400
It's so hard and it time just
goes by too fast. Well, first

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00:21:56.440 --> 00:21:57.880
of all, good morning, I'm
sorry I should say good morning morning.

324
00:21:59.000 --> 00:22:02.039
Yes, as you can see,
not as a well organized as I might

325
00:22:02.119 --> 00:22:04.839
otherwise be, but these things happen. And you were also a researcher at

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00:22:04.880 --> 00:22:10.319
the Center for Security Policy in Washington, DC. And oh oh, folks,

327
00:22:10.359 --> 00:22:12.200
by the way, I'm if you
want to get in on the fund

328
00:22:12.279 --> 00:22:15.240
here and on the podcast, take
me up on the offer I mentioned a

329
00:22:15.240 --> 00:22:19.319
little while ago about the three months
trial subscription to Ricochet, and you just

330
00:22:19.680 --> 00:22:22.920
never know. I mean, they
let me on this thing, and I'll

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00:22:22.000 --> 00:22:26.240
be happy to let you on this
thing, and we'll have a good chat,

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00:22:26.640 --> 00:22:29.599
fun chat, which is I'm sure
what Jenna hopes we will eventually have

333
00:22:29.759 --> 00:22:33.880
here this morning. It's always fun. But as Ricochet dot com slash gumbo.

334
00:22:34.160 --> 00:22:37.240
Okay, okay, So, Jenna, you worked at this Center for

335
00:22:37.279 --> 00:22:41.440
Security Policy, right, what kind
of what kind of what kind of research

336
00:22:41.480 --> 00:22:48.440
do they do? So they do
a lot of military awareness, future weapons

337
00:22:48.440 --> 00:22:52.079
systems, um mostly you know,
with Frank Affney when I was there,

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00:22:52.519 --> 00:22:59.480
folks a lot on um uh,
the Islamic threat, radical Islam here both

339
00:23:00.000 --> 00:23:03.319
you're in America and abroad. So
that I remembered him, I just didn't

340
00:23:03.319 --> 00:23:06.839
remember that that was his organization.
Okay, good. And then you did

341
00:23:06.960 --> 00:23:10.920
a year of law school and then
you sobered up. And so now now

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00:23:11.000 --> 00:23:14.640
you and your guess you could be
sitting in front of the Senate right now.

343
00:23:15.039 --> 00:23:18.119
Um, so you and your husband, who's also a veteran reside in

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the Minneapolis area. Now, you
wrote a fantastic piece a few days ago

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00:23:22.279 --> 00:23:26.240
or a week ago, I guess, but about a week ago called American

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Needs as Cowboys, and I guess
it was a trip to a Seattle I'm

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00:23:30.640 --> 00:23:33.880
sorry, a saddle shot in Seattle. God, I'm just my second cup

348
00:23:33.880 --> 00:23:37.359
of coffee and it's not working.
I was a saddle shop in Minneapolis,

349
00:23:37.440 --> 00:23:41.559
right, yeah, yeah, yep, yep. So it's shot s lines.

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00:23:41.599 --> 00:23:45.119
It doesn't. I read that.
I read that. I read it,

351
00:23:45.279 --> 00:23:47.680
and I'm never gonna be able.
I'm gonna need help with this.

352
00:23:47.839 --> 00:23:52.799
Just called shot what shot line?
Okay? All right? Yeah? And

353
00:23:52.880 --> 00:23:56.559
it survived the riots. Yeah,
so it's uh, it's right on Lake

354
00:23:56.599 --> 00:24:00.119
Street. It's been there since I
think nineteen eleven ish, so it was

355
00:24:00.119 --> 00:24:04.440
found or nineteen oh seven and then
they moved, just like the next store

356
00:24:04.519 --> 00:24:10.720
over on the same block, okay, founded by a German immigrant um and

357
00:24:10.759 --> 00:24:17.440
it's the third generation family owners and
I mean all Western English saddles, cowboy

358
00:24:17.480 --> 00:24:19.880
hats, boots. So cool and
you, yeah, very cool, you

359
00:24:19.960 --> 00:24:26.000
wrote on your piece. I'm gonna
quote you pretty extensively as this goes,

360
00:24:26.039 --> 00:24:29.559
But you wrote it. Perhaps it
was the cowboy tough, stubbornness. Maybe

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00:24:29.599 --> 00:24:33.680
the internet age makes us where as
a accessible beyond the chain scenery outside its

362
00:24:33.759 --> 00:24:37.720
doors. I think it all contributes
to the store survival. But it thrives

363
00:24:37.759 --> 00:24:41.359
because America's still is still cowboy country. So you're right, the America's had

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00:24:41.400 --> 00:24:45.319
a long, long love affair with
cowboys. Why do you what do you

365
00:24:45.400 --> 00:24:53.160
think that is? I think there's
a certain rugged individualism associated with the cowboy,

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00:24:53.200 --> 00:24:57.599
and maybe the wild wild West it's
so wild anymore, but uh,

367
00:24:57.720 --> 00:25:03.240
you know, people are. It's
a place for people just want to be

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00:25:03.319 --> 00:25:10.519
left alone and to fend for themselves
and not have so much oversight and interference.

369
00:25:11.400 --> 00:25:18.160
And there's always sort of a dichotomy
between the law and an order and

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00:25:18.359 --> 00:25:23.000
a little bit of taking managers in
your own hands and taking responsibility for your

371
00:25:23.000 --> 00:25:27.039
own actions. Yeah. Yeah.
Something else that you wrote in Doves Tales

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00:25:27.079 --> 00:25:30.960
perfectly too, that you say that
the American West of the late nineteenth century

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00:25:32.319 --> 00:25:36.519
was a cruel, harsh, lawless
frontier, and out of the mercilessness of

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00:25:36.519 --> 00:25:40.039
the land was born this new hero
who never looked for a score to settle,

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00:25:40.400 --> 00:25:44.799
but nevertheless found himself defending the defenseless
and standing between the tyrants and the

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00:25:44.920 --> 00:25:48.920
just. The cowboy never makes easy
decisions, but the line between right and

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00:25:48.000 --> 00:25:52.799
wrong is always bright. So so
do you see Americans, at least those

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00:25:52.839 --> 00:25:57.920
Americans who right now trying to preserve
the country's founding ideals rugged individualism, individual

379
00:25:57.960 --> 00:26:03.640
liberty, and kind of civil society
is having something in common with that iconic

380
00:26:03.720 --> 00:26:08.279
cowboy that you reference. I do, and I think it reflects on America

381
00:26:08.680 --> 00:26:14.960
more broadly historically as well. I
think if you look at you know,

382
00:26:14.960 --> 00:26:18.599
our participation in you know, especially
the world wars, us kind of a

383
00:26:18.720 --> 00:26:29.200
reluctant um bitter of of humanity and
peace and standing up for what's right and

384
00:26:29.279 --> 00:26:36.039
the defenseless and not particularly looking for
the fight, but knowing that it's the

385
00:26:36.119 --> 00:26:40.119
right thing to do. And I
think and hopefully we have people that step

386
00:26:40.200 --> 00:26:44.039
up, our leaders, uh,
you know, as we see more statues

387
00:26:44.079 --> 00:26:48.720
being toppled, I think Seattle thoughts, latest Lincoln and Roosevelt statues topple,

388
00:26:48.799 --> 00:26:53.839
then I h hopefully we have some
leaders that that say enough is enough,

389
00:26:55.039 --> 00:27:00.640
and we need to preserve what is
right and just although our his has flat,

390
00:27:00.680 --> 00:27:03.960
it still is the best in the
world, and we need to stand

391
00:27:04.000 --> 00:27:08.119
up for that and fight for it. But we never are go out and

392
00:27:08.200 --> 00:27:11.920
looking for the fight. You know, we're not We're not the aggressors by

393
00:27:11.920 --> 00:27:15.799
any stretch of the imagination. Yeah, you noticed that the statues don't fight

394
00:27:15.839 --> 00:27:19.759
back, and so they become the
targets, and buildings don't fight back,

395
00:27:19.759 --> 00:27:23.200
so they become the targets. So
essentially these are cowards and they need to

396
00:27:23.200 --> 00:27:26.880
be treated as such. There there's
my editorial moment for the day. My

397
00:27:26.960 --> 00:27:30.319
great grandfather. Thank you. I'll
be here all day, but don't forget

398
00:27:30.319 --> 00:27:33.240
to take tippy waitress. My great
grandfather. I believe I showed you his

399
00:27:33.279 --> 00:27:37.279
photo once. He fought in World
War One. But as a young guy,

400
00:27:37.279 --> 00:27:40.000
didn't I think I did, didn't
I? Yeah? Absolutely yeah.

401
00:27:40.200 --> 00:27:41.920
But as a young guy, he
hopped the train from Louisiana and went out

402
00:27:41.960 --> 00:27:47.079
west to work as a no kidding
cowboy. Just took a train and off

403
00:27:47.119 --> 00:27:51.599
he went. And he said the
gun smoke and the iconic shows of the

404
00:27:51.640 --> 00:27:56.000
seventies and that depicted Western life were
great, but they weren't realistic. He

405
00:27:56.039 --> 00:28:00.319
said it was a dirty, dirty
existence. By that he meant they worked

406
00:28:00.359 --> 00:28:07.160
hard, they got righteously dirty,
living and working in the elements. But

407
00:28:07.720 --> 00:28:11.960
but you know, he said that
the Petticoats know that what that wasn't happening.

408
00:28:11.359 --> 00:28:17.079
You know what, I could survive
as a as a woman in the

409
00:28:17.119 --> 00:28:19.960
West. Yah, right jeans,
Yeah, exactly, get to work.

410
00:28:21.480 --> 00:28:22.880
Uh. But as you say,
even the Greeks and the Romans had their

411
00:28:22.960 --> 00:28:27.000
legendary countrymen too that they look up
to, and it tried to emulate to

412
00:28:27.039 --> 00:28:32.119
some degree, So we have the
rugged individualism individualism of the cowboys. That

413
00:28:32.160 --> 00:28:36.160
an accurate comparison, I think.
So. I think you know, our

414
00:28:36.240 --> 00:28:41.640
heroes, as we passed down their
legacies from generation to generation, UM,

415
00:28:41.720 --> 00:28:51.039
you know, it gets it does
get a certain um idyllic idea. Yeah,

416
00:28:51.079 --> 00:28:55.200
absolutely absolutely, But I don't think
that that. I think for every

417
00:28:56.799 --> 00:29:02.359
romanticism that's associated with it, there's
still an element of truth there um and

418
00:29:02.400 --> 00:29:10.680
that we we should aspire to that
um higher truth of uh um and not

419
00:29:11.160 --> 00:29:14.759
run away from it. Right.
I think we should always aspire tip to

420
00:29:15.079 --> 00:29:18.559
an ideal um even though it's it's
maybe unattainable. But I think for the

421
00:29:18.599 --> 00:29:27.079
cowboy um that you know, you
know, romanticism in the sons of pioneers

422
00:29:27.200 --> 00:29:33.480
or whoever it may be, in
song or film or television, UH still

423
00:29:33.640 --> 00:29:40.000
is one that that holds onto that
cowboy code of virtue uh and freedom that

424
00:29:40.880 --> 00:29:45.599
I think is very important to to
pass the next generations. A country needs

425
00:29:45.640 --> 00:29:49.240
us role models and and uh we
have. We have a lot to choose

426
00:29:49.279 --> 00:29:52.640
from. I'm gonna I'm gonna with
your indulgence. I'm gonna read again.

427
00:29:52.880 --> 00:29:56.519
You know, if you quit writing
such great stuff I'd quit reading so much

428
00:29:56.519 --> 00:29:59.960
of it on the podcast. Well, I wish I wish you could writ

429
00:30:00.079 --> 00:30:06.000
don before No No, You're fun. But he wrote on the world stage,

430
00:30:06.039 --> 00:30:10.039
American cowboys often used as a pejorative. Theodore Roosevelt may have been the

431
00:30:10.039 --> 00:30:14.039
original rough rider and frontiersman, but
Ronald Reagan and George W. Bush were

432
00:30:14.079 --> 00:30:18.559
reviled for their quote unquote cowboy diplomacy
and inelegance. General George S. Patton,

433
00:30:18.640 --> 00:30:22.039
who was rebute for his frank style
and harsh tone, but as tough

434
00:30:22.079 --> 00:30:26.519
as Nail's attitude, brought Allied victories
in Europe. In cities in America,

435
00:30:26.559 --> 00:30:30.759
the police unhesitatingly answered the call for
help from the same people, from the

436
00:30:30.799 --> 00:30:36.079
same people who publicly insult, harass, and abuse them. Our military men

437
00:30:36.079 --> 00:30:38.480
and women, our first responders,
our emergency workers, do the hard things

438
00:30:38.480 --> 00:30:42.039
that make the streets safe for us, often thanklessly, then return to their

439
00:30:42.079 --> 00:30:48.200
post nothing, expecting nothing in return. My fear, you write, is

440
00:30:48.200 --> 00:30:52.359
that we are most closely resembling the
town than Clint Eastwood's High Plains Drifter,

441
00:30:52.720 --> 00:30:57.079
an outpost of cowards who trade their
identity for a compliance with corruption and lawlessness.

442
00:30:57.160 --> 00:31:00.240
So can you kind of take a
little deeper into that. Yeah,

443
00:31:00.240 --> 00:31:03.960
I assume you're making the point about
Portland, Seattle, or even Minneapolis and

444
00:31:03.960 --> 00:31:07.400
some other places where the inmates are
running the asylum right now. H Yeah,

445
00:31:07.440 --> 00:31:11.240
I think, uh, you know, and we're especially seeing in Minneapolis

446
00:31:11.240 --> 00:31:19.519
now. Even though the latest yesterday
the city council member um this distanced herself

447
00:31:19.599 --> 00:31:23.799
from she basically said, the spike
in the crime here is has nothing to

448
00:31:23.839 --> 00:31:29.440
do with us wanting to uh dismantle
the police department, of course, not

449
00:31:29.599 --> 00:31:33.079
no, send the police packing and
the bad guys show up. That's purely

450
00:31:33.119 --> 00:31:37.119
a coincidence. Yeah, yeah,
so, uh, it's it's it's definitely

451
00:31:37.119 --> 00:31:41.400
been a strain on the police here. Um. You know, they you

452
00:31:41.440 --> 00:31:47.279
push hard enough back on the people
that are willing to sacrifice their lives,

453
00:31:47.279 --> 00:31:51.480
their families, well being, uh
to protect us. And there's only so

454
00:31:51.519 --> 00:31:55.400
far they can be pushed before they
before they just call it quits and they

455
00:31:55.440 --> 00:31:57.519
and they don't come back. Yeah, put more stress on the ones that

456
00:31:57.519 --> 00:32:01.640
do remain. But I think in
a broader sense, Um, you know,

457
00:32:02.599 --> 00:32:07.480
for presidents, you know, they
well there's cowboy diplomacy or you know,

458
00:32:07.519 --> 00:32:13.519
criticizing George Bush for saying you're either
with us or against us. I

459
00:32:13.559 --> 00:32:17.960
think it's important too in the fight
of good versus evil, it's important to

460
00:32:17.960 --> 00:32:22.400
have that bright line. The more
ambiguous you get, the more it's easy

461
00:32:22.480 --> 00:32:31.400
for people just to hide under some
guys of uh pretentiousness or virtue signaling or

462
00:32:31.440 --> 00:32:38.799
sanctimony that they're above what needs to
be done um, which is doing the

463
00:32:38.839 --> 00:32:45.039
hard things, making a rest or
or joining a war effort um. You

464
00:32:45.079 --> 00:32:47.960
know, without those people, we
have nothing. If you don't If you

465
00:32:49.000 --> 00:32:52.000
don't draw a bright line, as
you say, and the great area gets

466
00:32:52.039 --> 00:32:55.839
larger and larger, that great area
contains loopholes, and people will exploit them.

467
00:32:57.880 --> 00:33:00.240
Yeah. Yeah, And I think
you know, I grew up watching

468
00:33:00.240 --> 00:33:05.000
a lot of Westerns with my parents, and you know, we'd always high

469
00:33:05.000 --> 00:33:08.160
planes. Jeffer always stuck out to
me as as sort of a nightmarish,

470
00:33:08.279 --> 00:33:16.799
uh garish reminder of how much people
will just hide in the herd and uh

471
00:33:17.519 --> 00:33:25.680
um u use other people's willing sacrifice
as cover for their own cowardice. Yeah,

472
00:33:25.799 --> 00:33:30.079
and I think that's one of the
things that I always took away from

473
00:33:30.079 --> 00:33:31.920
it, you know. Uh and
Clinton E swort of ends up kind of

474
00:33:32.240 --> 00:33:37.440
teaching them while a lesson and exposing
them for what they are. Great movie.

475
00:33:37.599 --> 00:33:40.680
Uh yeah, yeah, um,
well, and so many of the

476
00:33:40.680 --> 00:33:45.119
towns people had gone along with it. Uh. Jannis Desusa made a point,

477
00:33:45.359 --> 00:33:50.039
Uh well, he and I talked, but then made it years ago

478
00:33:50.440 --> 00:33:52.880
that you have a people, have
a group of people on campus, for

479
00:33:52.920 --> 00:33:55.960
example, in other other other areas, the radicals. They're not numerically a

480
00:33:57.000 --> 00:34:00.200
majority, but they fashioned themselves to
be a more whole majority, and they

481
00:34:00.240 --> 00:34:05.039
take advantage of the basic good will
of other folks just not to get involved

482
00:34:05.039 --> 00:34:08.760
in the craziness, and they exploit
that. And so silence on the part

483
00:34:08.760 --> 00:34:15.480
of the of good people becomes a
means for them to continue the radical actions

484
00:34:15.480 --> 00:34:17.840
that they're doing, tearing the place
apart where the statues, or assaulting the

485
00:34:17.840 --> 00:34:22.920
police or whatever. Yeah. And
and the farther along it goes, the

486
00:34:22.920 --> 00:34:25.800
harder it is to fight back,
the more entrench they get. Um.

487
00:34:25.840 --> 00:34:31.000
And I think we're really seeing that
now, especially um, you know,

488
00:34:31.239 --> 00:34:37.079
as we see the rewriting of history, um, the miseducation of our youth

489
00:34:38.760 --> 00:34:44.960
and the lies that are starting to
kind of be gas lit into reality,

490
00:34:45.360 --> 00:34:51.320
whether it's the sixteen nineteen project or
or I mean pick your the flavor of

491
00:34:51.320 --> 00:34:53.920
the month. I guess, um, as far as that goes so um

492
00:34:54.320 --> 00:34:59.840
and then so then the farther extreme
you have to kind of get to make

493
00:34:59.880 --> 00:35:05.519
that correction. So and it just
turns into this extreme back and forth,

494
00:35:05.639 --> 00:35:08.079
and it's going to be harder.
Like as you say, the longer it

495
00:35:08.119 --> 00:35:13.880
goes on, the harder it is
to roll back and restore some normalcy.

496
00:35:14.400 --> 00:35:17.320
Last question. But I've posed this
question to a lot of folks that are

497
00:35:17.440 --> 00:35:21.800
that I respect and whose wisdom I
respect. So now you're the latest recipient.

498
00:35:23.199 --> 00:35:28.039
I gotta look for somebody else that
no, no, no, no

499
00:35:27.719 --> 00:35:30.400
no, because I and you can
you maybe want to turn this into an

500
00:35:30.480 --> 00:35:34.280
article. I don't know, but
I've remember in twenty and sixteen it was

501
00:35:34.320 --> 00:35:37.920
all about the flight ninety three thing, right, yeah, Michael Anton,

502
00:35:37.079 --> 00:35:43.679
right, yeah, yeah. And
I'm wondering because every four years we hear

503
00:35:43.800 --> 00:35:45.760
this is the most important election in
our lifetime. Now we're here, this

504
00:35:45.800 --> 00:35:50.760
is the most important election in American
history. However, when you consider things

505
00:35:50.760 --> 00:35:55.039
like packing the court and uh,
just blowing up the filibuster and all kinds

506
00:35:55.079 --> 00:36:00.159
of things that would really eviscerate the
separation of powers and some meant a radical,

507
00:36:00.360 --> 00:36:06.559
permanent, radical governing majority. Then
you begin to wonder, is this,

508
00:36:06.760 --> 00:36:09.199
you know, is this such a
pivotal election after all? So my

509
00:36:09.320 --> 00:36:15.000
question to you is, we're seeing
a great many issues and policies framed in

510
00:36:15.119 --> 00:36:19.719
very stark relief right now. Do
you think this election constitutes perhaps our last

511
00:36:19.800 --> 00:36:23.440
chance to get it right, to
avoid the whole country descending into that outpost

512
00:36:23.519 --> 00:36:28.400
of cowards that you that we've been
talking about. Uh? Is this is

513
00:36:28.400 --> 00:36:30.679
this the last exit on the highway
to hell basically or not? What do

514
00:36:30.719 --> 00:36:36.039
you think? I think it's,
if not the last exit, maybe the

515
00:36:36.079 --> 00:36:42.760
second to last. Okay, I
think if if we if Donald Trump loses

516
00:36:42.760 --> 00:36:49.760
this election, and I think the
way the people, even on the right

517
00:36:49.760 --> 00:36:58.039
side, are framing it as all
about Trump without looking the reasons, at

518
00:36:58.039 --> 00:37:00.519
the reasons why he was elected in
the first place and why people backed him.

519
00:37:01.079 --> 00:37:05.199
Uh, and then and then just
putting all their eggs in the well,

520
00:37:05.239 --> 00:37:09.840
he's just uncouth. The people that
voted for Trump deserved what they got,

521
00:37:10.360 --> 00:37:16.159
instead of looking at maybe a little
more introspection on where the conservative movement

522
00:37:16.239 --> 00:37:23.400
is going or where Republicans where they're
missing the message from people, regular people

523
00:37:23.880 --> 00:37:28.920
um, instead of looking down at
them. Then I think then then yeah,

524
00:37:28.960 --> 00:37:34.000
then I think if they fail to
reflect on those particular things, then

525
00:37:34.000 --> 00:37:36.599
I think we are lost because they're
just going to side. It's just going

526
00:37:36.639 --> 00:37:40.440
to be, um, a total
steamroll from the left after that, because

527
00:37:40.440 --> 00:37:44.960
they have proven they don't really want
to fight. So, uh, the

528
00:37:45.760 --> 00:37:50.360
ratchet effect, whatever change there is, it's a pause in the steady march

529
00:37:50.400 --> 00:37:53.400
to the left as well they've been
able to do to this point. Yeah,

530
00:37:53.440 --> 00:37:59.920
and I really think that they have
failed to understand the value of push

531
00:38:00.199 --> 00:38:02.719
back. Uh. You know,
this is one thing that I was thinking

532
00:38:02.719 --> 00:38:10.480
about writing about today, UM for
this week, was how you know they

533
00:38:10.480 --> 00:38:14.679
always say about oh you can't you
know, Trump is the character issue,

534
00:38:15.039 --> 00:38:19.039
but you know, they criticize Mitt
Romney for his character. They criticized Brett

535
00:38:19.119 --> 00:38:22.960
Kavanaugh for his character, so that
doesn't really They're going to criticize whoever it

536
00:38:22.159 --> 00:38:28.400
is for their whatever it is.
They could be the second coming of Jesus,

537
00:38:28.440 --> 00:38:30.840
I don't know, and still say
something terrible about him and and it

538
00:38:30.840 --> 00:38:37.280
wouldn't matter, so, uh,
you just fight, please. They routinely

539
00:38:37.360 --> 00:38:42.039
vilify whether it was Romney or McCain
or George W. They vilify them when

540
00:38:42.079 --> 00:38:45.079
they're in office, and when they're
seeking office, they are they they are

541
00:38:45.159 --> 00:38:49.800
Hitler incarnate. Then after they've been
trounced or they've left office, suddenly they

542
00:38:49.840 --> 00:38:52.559
grow a halo and they're okay now. But it's the next guy that's awful.

543
00:38:52.960 --> 00:38:57.920
They've been doing that since Nixon at
least. Yeah. Yeah, and

544
00:38:57.920 --> 00:39:00.679
they're just gonna keep doing it.
So's to say that Trump is some anomaly,

545
00:39:01.239 --> 00:39:05.639
that he's worse than all the others. I mean, it's it's I

546
00:39:05.639 --> 00:39:08.639
think it's a losing argument. It's
it has no teeth to it to particularly

547
00:39:08.679 --> 00:39:12.360
when you look at the at the
opposition. I mean, you can talk

548
00:39:12.360 --> 00:39:15.239
about individuals, but ultimately it's the
agenda of the party that matters a great

549
00:39:15.280 --> 00:39:22.679
deal. So absolutely, and I
really think that the Democrats are I didn't

550
00:39:22.719 --> 00:39:25.719
want to see the enemy of the
people, but certainly the Constitution at this

551
00:39:25.800 --> 00:39:31.239
point. So we've seen it with
their court packing arguments. You know,

552
00:39:32.039 --> 00:39:39.119
they're lionizing of one justice to do
their legislative bidding. Um. So I

553
00:39:39.159 --> 00:39:44.519
think it's just part parcel of their
agenda. I'll paraphrase Ben Shapiro. He

554
00:39:44.599 --> 00:39:47.400
said that the Conservatives view the view
the Supreme Court as it means to protect

555
00:39:47.400 --> 00:39:52.519
and defend the constitution. Liberals view
the Supreme Court as a means to enact

556
00:39:52.519 --> 00:39:58.880
their agenda period. Absolutely, well, Jenna, as always has been a

557
00:39:58.880 --> 00:40:01.679
treat, has been fun. Uh, folks, you gotta you gotta check

558
00:40:01.719 --> 00:40:06.159
Jenna out on Ricochet and on Twitter
as well. I mean she she occasionally

559
00:40:06.159 --> 00:40:09.000
sends these thunderbolts of truth that are
cleverly disguised as tweets. But I mean

560
00:40:09.039 --> 00:40:12.480
it's good, stuck, what is
what is? What is your handle?

561
00:40:12.559 --> 00:40:14.960
Well? What what? What?
What? What are we supposed to call

562
00:40:15.000 --> 00:40:22.360
you? On Twitter? At Jenna
Lynn okay eighty eight and Jenna Lynn eighty

563
00:40:22.400 --> 00:40:24.360
eight, l y n N two
ends in Lynn and two ends in Jenna.

564
00:40:24.519 --> 00:40:28.599
Right, you got it? Okay, all right, awesome, Look,

565
00:40:28.599 --> 00:40:30.079
it's been a pleasure as always,
and I'll probably get you on here

566
00:40:30.079 --> 00:40:32.760
after the election so we can make
an after action assessment of what happened.

567
00:40:32.760 --> 00:40:37.840
What the hell happened? Oh boy, Yeah, that'll be a good that'll

568
00:40:37.920 --> 00:40:40.199
be good no matter what is with
you. Yeah, Well, thank you

569
00:40:40.440 --> 00:40:45.360
and take care of folks, adds
Jenna Stalker on the Dave Carter Program for

570
00:40:45.440 --> 00:40:53.880
the Person who has Everything, it's
Antibiotickes. No wait, it's Dave Carter

571
00:40:54.360 --> 00:41:06.280
on Ricoche as Jenna Stoker. If
you want a good reason to become part

572
00:41:06.320 --> 00:41:08.079
of Ricochet, one of those reasons
would have would be the chance to interact

573
00:41:08.079 --> 00:41:13.320
with folks like Jenna and so many
others on Ricochet whose insights and perspectives are

574
00:41:13.320 --> 00:41:15.719
always worth reading and hearing. I
mean, even if you don't always agree,

575
00:41:15.760 --> 00:41:20.679
and trust me not everyone on Ricochet
walks and lock step on any number

576
00:41:20.719 --> 00:41:22.760
of topics, and there have been
some quite spirited debates on the site.

577
00:41:23.360 --> 00:41:27.440
Even when you don't think you agree
with someone, you can still learn from

578
00:41:27.440 --> 00:41:30.320
them and understand at least why they
think is they do and what kind of

579
00:41:30.400 --> 00:41:34.480
data they have to back up their
assertions. I'm a bit of a stickler

580
00:41:34.480 --> 00:41:37.280
on that point, By the way. I got into a mini debate on

581
00:41:37.320 --> 00:41:40.239
social media a few days ago with
respect to a former First Lady Michelle Obama's

582
00:41:40.239 --> 00:41:45.199
assertion that the research backs up quote
unquote, the claim that what we've seen

583
00:41:45.559 --> 00:41:51.519
this summer has been an overwhelmingly peaceful
movement for racial solidarity. Where is she

584
00:41:51.639 --> 00:41:54.519
missing the point, one guy asked, and at which point I laid out

585
00:41:54.599 --> 00:42:00.599
exactly what the research backs up,
which includes twelve thousand, forty five incidents,

586
00:42:00.639 --> 00:42:04.280
is civil unrest between May twenty six
and September sixteenth, But six hundred

587
00:42:04.280 --> 00:42:08.760
and thirty three of those incidents coded
as riots by the nonprofit Armed Conflict Location

588
00:42:08.800 --> 00:42:14.159
and Event Data Project, which is
supported in the US by Princeton University,

589
00:42:14.480 --> 00:42:17.199
fifty one of those riots lacked information
about the rioters' identities. But of the

590
00:42:17.320 --> 00:42:22.880
remaining five hundred and eighty two riots
in which the identities of the rioters were

591
00:42:22.000 --> 00:42:28.800
known, Black Lives Matters activists were
involved in ninety five percent of the riots,

592
00:42:28.840 --> 00:42:34.239
rendering missus Obama's assertions about as reliable
as those of a mid level Soviet

593
00:42:34.239 --> 00:42:38.280
epiatic. The response from the other
party all this was, this discussion was

594
00:42:38.320 --> 00:42:44.000
to reduce the actual research to picking
cherries. You picked the ones that you

595
00:42:44.079 --> 00:42:47.119
want, okay. So one side
in the debate deals in hard data,

596
00:42:47.159 --> 00:42:53.480
in facts, and in the other
side deals in a continuing narrative of endless

597
00:42:53.519 --> 00:42:59.960
oppression and systemic justice, and in
half truths and presuppositions from which no comprehensive

598
00:43:00.079 --> 00:43:05.159
analysis is allowed to intrude. They
say silence is violence. Well, speech

599
00:43:05.199 --> 00:43:07.840
is violence. Too, they say, depending on the pigmentation of the person

600
00:43:07.880 --> 00:43:12.000
that's students speaking. I say,
the silence in the face of riots and

601
00:43:12.039 --> 00:43:15.679
assaults and plunder and lawlessness is tacit
encouragement. And we no longer have the

602
00:43:15.760 --> 00:43:20.960
luxury remaining silent on election day.
We should make our voices heard, and

603
00:43:21.039 --> 00:43:23.960
make them heard resoundingly. Now,
between now and then, I'll keep bringing

604
00:43:24.000 --> 00:43:28.719
you some of the best voices,
some of the best minds and the commentary

605
00:43:28.760 --> 00:43:30.440
out there. And I invite you
to listen, enjoy your own conclusions.

606
00:43:30.480 --> 00:43:32.960
Please. And if you enjoyed the
show today and you'd like to hear more

607
00:43:32.960 --> 00:43:36.920
of this kind of thing or read
a collection of my columns and essays and

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00:43:36.920 --> 00:43:39.119
stuff, and I write invite you
to go over to Dave Carter her own

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00:43:39.159 --> 00:43:42.880
line, where you'll find a lot
more of this kind of thing, from

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00:43:42.960 --> 00:43:46.079
articles are written over the years to
current articles of interests that others have written.

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00:43:46.320 --> 00:43:50.400
There's also a page of podcasts for
you're listening pleasure, which will include

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00:43:50.400 --> 00:43:52.559
this podcast as well, and a
page called the Inkwell. Now, that's

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00:43:52.599 --> 00:43:57.599
where I write more introspective pieces for
readers of my website, including a piece

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00:43:57.599 --> 00:44:00.280
I wrote just a week or so
ago called I do I do all this

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00:44:00.320 --> 00:44:05.000
in the first place? Why do
the writing, the podcasting, the incessant

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00:44:05.039 --> 00:44:08.000
reading and learning and passing along these
things that people might enjoy thinking about?

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00:44:08.039 --> 00:44:12.559
Well, the short an answer is
because that's the way I'm built. Let's

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00:44:12.559 --> 00:44:15.119
see for yourself. Over Dave Carter
online dot com, check out the inkbell

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00:44:15.199 --> 00:44:19.639
page and read all about it.
The podcast here continues to grow, as

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00:44:19.639 --> 00:44:22.599
it just currently heard all of the
world, and we're certainly grateful that you're

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00:44:22.639 --> 00:44:24.840
listening in with us today. Please
feel free to go over to iTunes give

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00:44:24.920 --> 00:44:28.519
us a five star rating, write
your own comments about the show. I

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00:44:28.599 --> 00:44:30.960
read them, and the more good
ratings we get, the course, the

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00:44:30.960 --> 00:44:34.480
fast that we grow, and the
better things to come. So with that

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00:44:35.199 --> 00:44:37.760
I stend my thanks and gratitude to
Tanista Susa for talking with us at the

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00:44:37.840 --> 00:44:42.760
Jennas Stalker for sharing her insights,
and a special thanks to you the listener.

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00:44:43.000 --> 00:44:47.079
I'm Dave Carter and I'll see you
next time. Thank you for listening

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00:44:47.079 --> 00:44:52.360
to the Dave Carter Show. Don't
forget to subscribe on iTunes so you will

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00:44:52.480 --> 00:44:55.039
miss a single episode. And while
you're there, please leave a review and

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00:44:55.079 --> 00:44:59.039
tell us who you think and on
behalf of all of us at the Dave

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00:44:59.079 --> 00:45:07.239
Carter Show the Ricochet Audio Network.
Thank you for listening. He m