Oct. 31, 2024

Dr. Anders W. Edwardsson on "Radical Betrayal"

Dr. Anders W. Edwardsson on "Radical Betrayal"

Dave sits down with author and scholar https://defiancepress.com/authors/edwardsson-anders/ to discuss his recent...

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Interviews Culture

Dave sits down with author and scholar Dr. Anders W. Edwardsson to discuss his recent book, Radical Betrayal; How Liberals and Neoconservatives are Wrecking American Exceptionalism. Exploring a book of extraordinary depth, Dave and Dr. Edwardsson take us on a journey that begins as far back as Mesopotamia, exploring recurring historical themes and the roots of political movements whose threads weave through the totality of the human experience and onto the pages of today's headlines.

From the rugged individualim that helped spur the American Revolution to the dominance of progresssive ideas on the national stage, contending visions of man's relationship to the state and to his fellow man unfold as the conversation stops at crucial points in American history before Dr. Edwardsson takes an unflinching assessment of where America is today and the choices we face. It's a compelling conversattion that you won't want to miss.

Don't forget to take a look at Dave's Website at Dave Carter Online, and keep tuning into future episodes as our host prepares for special eiditon of the Dave Carter Show to be recorded in front of a live audience in the Florida panhandle!

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Soldier storyteller, this story of Hell Raiser. It's Dave Carter

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and this is the Dave Carter Show.

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I'm Dave Carter and it's a pleasure as always to

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welcome you to the program. Now we're going to change

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things up a bit today. There's an old saying, purportedly

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a Chinese saying, though there's some dispute about the exact origin.

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The saying goes, may you live in interesting times? The

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sayings often used as a sort of curse. But regardless,

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few people can doubt that we do indeed live in

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interesting times. The show today is being recorded less than

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a week from the twenty twenty four presidential election, and

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with the trajectory that the country has taken the last

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four years, doubt that it's been interesting all right. In fact,

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we're living in consequential times, and in less than a

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week Americans will decide the nature of the consequences they

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will unfold for us, yes, but most importantly for our children,

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our grandchildren, and on and on.

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So this will be a bit different. Today.

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We're going to devote the entirety of the show to

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having a conversation with an extremely accomplished gentleman, A brilliant scholar,

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because this is one of those times when we need

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to turn down the political static, if you will, the

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noise from the NonStop spins of the campaign, the media

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noise telling you that you didn't really hear or see

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what you actually heard and saw. So this is going

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to be both informative and fun, which means that you'll

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be listening to someone other than me doing most of

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the talking. Year ANDREWS. W. Edwardson was born in Dallaskag, Sweden.

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He was keenly interested in history and politics in his youth,

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so he pursued intense academic studies, receiving an MA in

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history at oups Kaula University in two thousand and two.

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After studying US history at the University of North Dakota

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in Grand Forks that even sounds cold, he returned to

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Europe and worked as a field archaeologist in Ireland and

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the United Kingdom, after which he moved back to Sweden

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and authored two books on Swedish history, and also worked

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as a political commentator in syndicated columnists, before moving permanently

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to the US in twenty eleven to study politics at

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the Catholic University of America. In Washington, d C. That's

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where he earned his PhD in twenty twenty one, and

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I thought I'd had an eventful life. He now resides

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with his wife Jen outside of Tampa, Florida, where doctor

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Edwardson enjoys bike riding sunnyweather, that is, when he and

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Jen aren't busy dodging hurricanes.

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I presume he's.

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The author of the book Radical Betrayal, How Liberals and

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neo Conservatives are Wrecking American Exceptionalism. It is published by

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Defiance Press and Publishing, and it is an honor to

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welcome doctor Edwardson to the program here. Good morning, doctor Edwardson, Good.

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Morning, and thank you for that very nice introduction.

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Thank you, sir, well, thank you for taking the time

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to talk with us. But just by the way, as

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we start off here, did you manage to escape the

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hurricanes unscathed?

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Yes, the second one we were playing gets Safe and

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I went up to a friend outside at Lamb Dane, Georgia.

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I can't say I blame you there.

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We came home to a house with the roof everything great.

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Great.

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Now, my first thought when reading your book was the

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way in which you take a recurring historical theme or

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the roots of a political movement, and you highlight the

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thread of that movement and that theme as they weave

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their way through American history and evolve into what we

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see on the news each day. So I may sound

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territorial territorial here, but I was amazed at the depth

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of your research and analysis. So a couple of questions

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to start with. Please, First, what was it about the

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US that so captured your interest in the first place?

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And second, what was your primary goal in writing this book?

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Well, my interest in American and American politics goes way back.

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To start with, that belonged to Swedish family. A lot

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of people moved over here in the nineteenth century and

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a few came back, and I'm the great grandson of

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one of those guys who decided to go back. Okay,

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so I grew up with American Yeah, we always talked

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about America. We had American relatives coming visiting. And then

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on election night nineteen eighty I managed to talk my

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mother into to sit up and watch Swedish television because

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the election results was in the middle of the night. Yeah,

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Swedish television decided to show one of Reagan's old movies

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and I loved the Western movies as a kids. I

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negged my mother to sit up and watch that, but

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she went to bed. She went to bed, and of

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course I didn't stop watching when the movie was over,

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even if I didn't know the language. Really, but I

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watched the whole election watch thing, and it was just

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something that clicked with Reagan and American politics. And as

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a ten year old, I even managed to figure out

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how the electoral college worked.

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So you're away ahead a lot of the folks here.

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Yeah, maybe that. So that's long story short that That's

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how I got interested in avios, continued for movies, books, studies,

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and then I moved over here in twenty eleven and permanently,

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and I met my wife literally a couple of days after,

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and we got married after seven months.

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And wow, here I am so the primary goal a

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purpose in writing your book, just as a basic We'll

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get into a lot of details, but just to summarize what.

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You were trying to accomplish. What was it?

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It is that when I came over here permanently, I

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started to pick up on a disconnect between what I

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thought I knew about America and how it should be

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and how it should work. And how people should be

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and think and all that, and how very different from

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these large segments of the political world was you have

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on one side, you had the Democratic Party that has

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the last thirty years or so got so far left

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that they effectively are not an American party like the

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old Democratic Party, JFK's Party and so on, that was

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still an American party ideologically and intellectually. The Democrats of

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today are effectively are European Social Democratic Party. And also

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on the other side, I picked up on a disconnect

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because the founding fathers set up America as a freedom

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model for the rest of the world to follow if

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and when they were ready and wanted to do it.

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You can't force freedom upon people. That that's an old,

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old truth. So but the neo cons the War Party

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of the Republican Party, I found that they were They

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hadn't left America as the Democratic Party, but they had

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gone so far out on some kind of limb that

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they didn't reflect the American heritage. And that's what I'm

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trying to show that this is what happened. And I

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give the history behind these two developed parallel developments, uh

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and and and how they have unfolded over time.

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Well, and it's a it's a it's very thorough and

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comprehensive history that you present as well. Let's start with

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a term that is the theme of the book. The

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book again is called UH Betrayal how liberals and neo

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conservatives are wrecking American exceptionalism. Let's start with a termine.

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Define it American exceptionalism, which you refer to in your

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book as americanism. So for the purposes of your work,

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what what does that term entail?

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What does it mean?

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Well, I make UH, I make a broad interpretation of

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that term, and I more or less equals it with

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what we can call America nationalism. It's the story about America,

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why the country was founded, what it stood for, and

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what it should work for. And this was all all nations, democratic,

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the tatorship, communists, fascist, nationalists, somewhere in the middle liberal.

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Every country has a nationalist national story defining these things.

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Who are we, where do we come from? Where are

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we going? And for a very long time, the founding

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Father's definition of these things was accepted by everybody left,

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right and center. There were no real left and right

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in the European traditional meaning up until the early twentieth

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century in America, but both the Democrats and the Republicans

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were in different ways center right part is if you

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look from my European perspectives on them, they were for

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stage rights, low taxes, few regulations. They just had different

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and faces and different focus in many ways.

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I'm sorry, go ahead, sorry, Well, I was just gonna say.

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And you just made it them might say, you answer

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my second question actually, which is over time the American

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receptionism or americanism has that meaning? Has the story has

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changed depending on the political needs of whoever is leading

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the country at a given time. If I may just

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to give our listeners an idea.

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Of the encyclopedic scope of your work.

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Here, the early passages of the book take us all

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the way back to Mesopotamia around twenty three hundred BC,

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and the need for rulers during that time and sense

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to ensure that people see them as to use your words,

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guaranteurs of internal harmony and external peace, and you trace

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the evolution of nations and rulers and empires throughout that time.

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I'm speeding through to bring us to the shores of

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the American colonies and the things that set them apart

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from their from their fellow Englishmen across the ocean. There

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was an individualistic streak on the part of the colonists,

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and that was due in part to what sort of

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factors set the colonists apart, you know, in terms of

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their perspective on governance and life generally from their fellow

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Englishmen across the ocean.

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Yeah, first and foremost the distance itself, the Atlantic Ocean.

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The colonists were English. They saw themselves as proud Englishmen

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almost up until seventeen seventy six, and they looked back

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to like Magna Carta in what was it, twelve fifteen

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or something like that, and these England a much freer

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country than all other European countries for a number of

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historical reasons. We don't really need to go we can't,

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we don't have time to go into them here. But

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this freedom tradition, an individual form of early modern individualism,

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and the English freedom tradition came over with the colonists.

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And since London was literally a world see away, these feelings,

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these views of we are free men who are individuals,

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got crystallized over here. So when in the seventeen hundreds,

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when politicians and kings in London started to squeeze and

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bend and to some extent break the colonists traditional freedoms

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they protested, and that that led to the American Revolution

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or the American and the War of Liberty, whatever you

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want to call it. And so the English freedom and

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individual tradition was transplanted to America and came to bloom

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here in a much more purified form than it could

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do over in England. And this is the basis for

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what we can call American exceptionalism. That we are free,

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we're individualistic, which use what religions we want to believe

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in and so on, and so for a free economy,

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few regulations, states rights, you name it. All these things

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goes down to this freedom tradition mixed up with traditional

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classic philosophy and also Enlightenment. Thinking that the American ideology

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taking four in the late seventeen hundreds is in a

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way a misshmash of three four different traditions, but it

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turned out to be extremely strong, valuable, and effective. It

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made America the strongest and the most wealthy country in

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the world in less than a century.

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I guess, yeah, that makes perfect sense.

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I guess we often use the term rugged individualism, but

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I guess that's what circumstances kind of not imposed, but

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allowed us to draw from. Now having authored and signed

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the Declaration of Independence, the rebel colonies then developed what

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you referred to as a civil religion. And I know

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that this varies from one country to the other. So

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what did that term mean in the context of the colonies.

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What was their civil religion at the time of the founding?

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Yeah, I mean every country. As I said, every country

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hash and nash no story. And in the old days

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what we can call proto nationalism or early nationalism or whatever.

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As you said, I start already in Mesopotamia, because all

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political entities bigger than one or two small small villages

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need need this to stick together. It's like a mental

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glue that keeps people together. You can keep people together

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at the point of a gun. The problem with that

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is that as soon as you run out of m

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o people, a run in all directions can convince people

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that we are coming from the same place we are going,

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We have common goals, we are brothers and sisters, et cetera.

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They tend to stick together even through tough times. And

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as I said, the American form of this has its deep,

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deep route in English classical and an Enlightenment thinking, and

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American exceptionalism became this glue that kept kept us all

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together for a century and a half plus. It has

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started to peter out now because we will probably get

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to that too, because the Democrats has gone so far

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to the left and the neocons so far too out

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on something else.

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Right, Well, we will trust me.

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Yeah. So I don't know if this answer your question,

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but that this glue, this American exceptionalism and American nationalism,

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call it whatever you want. It took four more around

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seventeen seventy six seventeen eighty nine, and it has changed.

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It changed a little bit, and it was but it

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was basically untouched up until the early mid twentieth century

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when when it was more and more questioned by ideologues

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and intellectuals and academics and figures like that.

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You noted in your.

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Book that it actually didn't take terribly long for American

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politicians to push against the guardrails, if you will, such

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as what was outline in Washington's farewell address, And for example,

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you write that George Washington's foreign policy was effectively dissolved

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in eighteen twenty three with the Monroe Doctrine, which announced

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that any European intervention in the New World will be

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considered a hostile act. But you write that the decade

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of the eighteen nineties became a watershed in American history.

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There were economic issues, political changes, and more that helped

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usher in the progressive era.

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Is my reading of that correct?

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Yes, I wouldn't say that that Washington's foreign policy was

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a banned and already in eighteen twenty three, even if

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the Monroe doctor was the first indication of where things

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were heading. Long term, the formal break, the big break

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with Washington's peaceful foreign policy, non interventionist foreign policy. It

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was a process, of course, but the big, the formal

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happening was the American Spanish Spanish American War of eighteen

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ninety eight, when we decided to go in and take

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Cuba from who was back then still a Spanish colony,

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take Cuba from the Spanish, introduce American freedoms political and

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economic and other freedoms there, and helped the Cubans to

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help themselves, so to speak. And so there was nothing

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devious or evil behind this. It was just a naive

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belief that you could see invader country take away all

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the bad guys and introduce American style freedom.

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Right, right, right.

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It's regarding of the Spanish heritage was much more autocratic,

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much more violent, much more whatever you want, compared to

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the American experience. Well, and there we see that. You

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can rag that all the way up to the invasion

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of Iraq in two thousand and three. Yeah.

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Sure.

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One of the foremost architects of progressivism in the early

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twentieth century was Woodrow Wilson, who, as you noted in

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the book, observed that the Constitution's negative freedoms were a

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restriction on federal power, and he felt them to be

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increasingly oppressive, meaning that the Constitution oppressed his ability to

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steer the country in his desired direction.

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I'm wondering how he managed.

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To overcome some of the Constitution's restrictions. Did he have

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to alter the civil religion that we spoke.

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Earlier in order to pull this off?

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He partly reinterpreted the Constitution. And this is a story

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in itself, because the Constitution has all historical texts, and

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everything was written by people at a certain time that

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was marked by certain cultural, social, and other opinions and views.

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And as everything changes over time. So what happened during

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the nineteenth century, especially towards the end of it, was

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that a growing number of radicals started to look down

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and wrinkle their noses at this leave us alone kind

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of freedom ethos that the US Constitution was written to

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protect and I hope, and they were of a more

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modern view. It's called modern. I think it's quite ancient, actually,

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because but that the state knew better people needed help

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by good hearted politicians and stuff to live their lives

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and improve their lives and stuff like that, just like

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over in Europe, and because the progresses of effectively non

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socialist social democrats that's a definition of its own. But

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they wanted to use the federal government to improve people's lives,

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improve America top down, and that went straight against what

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the founding fathers had said, who said we should have

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a minimal government, protecting the borders and taking care of

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foreign policy and currence, yeah, maybe a few, very few

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other things, and then leave people in states alone to

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deal with their own business and build their own lives.

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But this wasn't good enough for the do gooders of

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the progressive moment, so they started with it actually started

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with with Theodore Roosevelt, even if he was a Republican,

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he was are progressive also, and he once there is

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one episode Theodore Roosevelt was once accused of having been

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doing something. I don't remember what it was, but someone

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asked him, where is the support in the Constitution for

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you doing this? And then he just sneezed and said,

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if the Constitution doesn't forbid me to do it, I

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can do it. In that single sentence, he turned the

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American political heritage upside down because the Constitution had been

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written by people for a people who was on the

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absolute opposite end of the spectrum. There they the president

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should only be able to do what the constitutions tell

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him that he must do. And after that the floodgates

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started to open because Congress of course followed suit, and

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so the courts and the whole mentality change from us

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we should have such small political powers as possible to

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what can we do? What more can we do? And

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of course with that king taxes and regulations and everything

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we are stuck in up to our arrivals today.

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You sound like he essentially negated the reason for breaking

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from Georgia third and the first place.

335
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Way.

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Yeah, yeah, in.

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The interest of time, and I'm going to gloss over

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a lot of parts of your book that are folks.

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It's positively fascinating, and I urge our listeners to read

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for themselves what I'm talking about. But two principal figures

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in American history, Widrow Wilson and Franklin Roosevelt, preside not

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only over transformational initiatives in American domestic and economic life,

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but they also preside over two world wars, from which

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America emerges as the pre eminent world economic and military power.

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The postwar years features a class of people that you

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refer to in your book as the gatekeepers. You're right

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quote next to pre Civil War plantation owners. This became

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the closest America has ever been to having an actual

349
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leisure class unquote.

350
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Who are these folks?

351
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Well, in today they are politeerians, academicsjournalysts, well everyone who

352
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had who who is part of the today's elite. So

353
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not many of them are of different different opinions, but

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there is a core view still a progressive core of

355
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the American elite, and has been for over one hundred

356
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years now. And of course they set the tone. They

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there's not formal censorship at least not yet. But take

358
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take a simple figure like someone who is in charge

359
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of a local library. He or she decides what books

360
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are bought by the local library. That that that that

361
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people can read. That that's probably more before internet and stuff.

362
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But the local newspapers editor editor in chief, who decides

363
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what news to be printed, what letters to the editor

364
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to be taken in, and what opinion pieces to be

365
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printed and stuff like that. They are all gatekeepers. And

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what has happened during the last one hundred hundred and

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twenty five years is that the overwhelming majority of these

368
00:26:19.839 --> 00:26:28.079
has been or become progressives. It's these people who think

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that we don't. Only today it has gone to such

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an extreme. So they don't even know the difference between

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a boy and a girl. And I think there's fifty

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seven yenders.

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Or something, right, And that's supposed to be enlightened.

374
00:26:40.720 --> 00:26:45.359
Yes, yes, yes, because they describe themselves as enlightened. They

375
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see themselves as enlightened. You just as all European aristocracy.

376
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They say we know better than the simpletons out there

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deserves and the peasants. And you can see this very

378
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I mean, Biden called us garbage now the day. Yes,

379
00:27:05.160 --> 00:27:09.480
that that that's an extreme, but that's it's a traditional

380
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scenes to antique times for an urban looking down on

381
00:27:14.759 --> 00:27:18.400
normal people and their their narrow minded views.

382
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I like the way that you describe how they how

383
00:27:22.720 --> 00:27:26.119
they promote their theories. You say new class is primary

384
00:27:26.200 --> 00:27:29.880
way to promote change was to field theories within the

385
00:27:29.880 --> 00:27:35.519
iron triangle of politics, academia, and media, to create new

386
00:27:35.559 --> 00:27:39.480
discourses simply by cross referencing each other and encircling their

387
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bubble with peer review systems and research grants. This makes

388
00:27:42.960 --> 00:27:46.000
it all but impossible to challenge their views or the

389
00:27:46.119 --> 00:27:50.599
scientific consensus as they call them, unquote. Would this Would

390
00:27:50.640 --> 00:27:52.720
it be an over generalization on my part to call

391
00:27:52.759 --> 00:27:55.359
this government by faculty lounge.

392
00:27:55.599 --> 00:28:00.400
No, No, that's It's the important thing to keep in

393
00:28:00.480 --> 00:28:04.000
mind here is that this is nothing new. It has

394
00:28:04.160 --> 00:28:08.039
worked like this. That's why I actually spent the page

395
00:28:08.160 --> 00:28:12.599
or two on Mesopotamia and Asian robe. It has worked

396
00:28:12.640 --> 00:28:15.799
like this from the beginning. The owner there has been

397
00:28:15.839 --> 00:28:20.240
an elite who has had a more or less monopoly

398
00:28:20.519 --> 00:28:26.039
on information, printing presses, all that kind of stuff through

399
00:28:26.200 --> 00:28:30.799
history and his first week Internet that this bubble they

400
00:28:31.039 --> 00:28:36.319
surround themselves with has started to crack podcasts like yours

401
00:28:36.599 --> 00:28:44.200
and websites like mine, and the bubble is ready to

402
00:28:44.319 --> 00:28:49.279
burst to something new, hopefully much better. But this is

403
00:28:49.319 --> 00:28:53.279
a five thousand plus year old curse we are dealing

404
00:28:53.359 --> 00:29:00.000
with here that those up there has, by owning the media's,

405
00:29:00.160 --> 00:29:05.160
through state, churches, whatever, they have controlled the information and

406
00:29:05.240 --> 00:29:09.319
with that our view of the world and how things work.

407
00:29:09.720 --> 00:29:14.559
He's the practical example of this from today, the climate

408
00:29:14.759 --> 00:29:18.160
change hysteria. I'm not saying that it may not be

409
00:29:18.319 --> 00:29:23.640
a kernel of truth in that CO two human CO

410
00:29:23.960 --> 00:29:29.680
two emissions add to an otherwise normal climate change. But

411
00:29:30.039 --> 00:29:38.400
the absolute fundamentalis and craziness these people, they have brainwashed

412
00:29:38.559 --> 00:29:44.640
generations to throw these days. They are so convinced that

413
00:29:44.799 --> 00:29:48.359
climate change must stop that they are trying to destroy

414
00:29:48.440 --> 00:29:53.039
the mona Lisa in the louver right casting paint on her.

415
00:29:53.839 --> 00:29:55.720
I mean, it's a mental disease.

416
00:29:56.319 --> 00:30:00.519
You're exactly right, of course. I think that maybe you

417
00:30:00.839 --> 00:30:02.680
we'll find out if you agree or not. Talking about

418
00:30:02.720 --> 00:30:07.359
government government by faculty lounge, I think immediately of Barack Obama,

419
00:30:07.519 --> 00:30:11.279
who perhaps the gatekeepers paved the way to you described

420
00:30:11.319 --> 00:30:15.119
Barack Obama as one of many of his contemporaries who

421
00:30:15.519 --> 00:30:19.359
you say, were all media savage pseudo intellectuals on scientifically

422
00:30:19.480 --> 00:30:24.920
dubious at best, but politically attractive subjects like structural discrimination,

423
00:30:25.000 --> 00:30:28.880
global warming, open borders, and list goes on. Essentially, you

424
00:30:28.960 --> 00:30:33.519
note that Obama described our present challenges as the new normal?

425
00:30:34.079 --> 00:30:38.119
Is that the kind of thing that brought us Donald Trump,

426
00:30:38.200 --> 00:30:40.200
who you call the great disruptor?

427
00:30:41.559 --> 00:30:47.000
Yes, because despite all their powers, despite all their TV

428
00:30:47.119 --> 00:30:53.400
stations and stuff, the American freedom and individual heritage, individualism

429
00:30:53.480 --> 00:30:57.720
heritage was so strong that in America what we can

430
00:30:57.799 --> 00:31:01.720
call a different different views or common sense, call it whatever,

431
00:31:02.079 --> 00:31:10.759
a non relatistic worldview, and us, on many areas and

432
00:31:10.799 --> 00:31:14.240
in many subjects, I have survived much more than it

433
00:31:14.279 --> 00:31:20.680
has over in the top down rule Europe. And Donald

434
00:31:20.680 --> 00:31:25.680
Trump became He's that forward in twenty fifteen as a

435
00:31:25.799 --> 00:31:31.680
talking head for I'm your guy. If you want to

436
00:31:31.720 --> 00:31:38.119
feel me, I'm here for you. It's and that was

437
00:31:39.000 --> 00:31:45.279
half a century at least of damned up then wishes

438
00:31:45.559 --> 00:31:50.920
and frustrations and dreams and stuff of more than half

439
00:31:50.960 --> 00:31:55.319
the America, even if it didn't get half of the vote.

440
00:31:55.359 --> 00:32:02.359
He represents maybe two thirds or something of most Americans.

441
00:32:02.400 --> 00:32:05.480
Everyday view of the world and what's important and what's

442
00:32:05.559 --> 00:32:07.160
right and wrong and stuff like that.

443
00:32:07.519 --> 00:32:11.319
He connects with folks and he resonates with people. You

444
00:32:11.400 --> 00:32:15.960
say that the Trump's view of Americanism is complex, that

445
00:32:16.079 --> 00:32:20.519
he quote views politicians' primary duty to always put their

446
00:32:20.559 --> 00:32:24.920
country first, leaving little room for mystic destinies and missions

447
00:32:25.200 --> 00:32:28.359
stretching over generations. So I'm wondering is that does that

448
00:32:28.400 --> 00:32:31.599
put him in an unconventional way? But does that make

449
00:32:31.680 --> 00:32:35.079
him more in tune with the founders than many of

450
00:32:35.119 --> 00:32:36.519
Trump's predecessors have been.

451
00:32:38.079 --> 00:32:41.640
He definitely makes him more in tune with You see

452
00:32:41.640 --> 00:32:44.160
which one should we take here? He's more in tune

453
00:32:44.200 --> 00:32:48.039
with George Washington and John Adams than he is with

454
00:32:48.359 --> 00:32:52.480
Thomas Paine and Thomas Jefferson back in the day. But

455
00:32:52.759 --> 00:32:57.599
all those four Founders he's more in tune with. Trump

456
00:32:57.680 --> 00:33:01.359
is in tune much more with those then he was

457
00:33:01.480 --> 00:33:08.519
with even Ronald Reagan, the Bill Clinton, Barack Obama, and

458
00:33:08.640 --> 00:33:17.799
George W. Bush, who the two Republicans, two Democrats who

459
00:33:17.880 --> 00:33:22.640
wanted something completely different, well both at home and abroad,

460
00:33:23.440 --> 00:33:26.920
than what the founding fathers wanted. And Trump is much

461
00:33:27.000 --> 00:33:30.279
more in tune, as you say, with George Washington and

462
00:33:31.079 --> 00:33:35.920
down the other founders than he is with any at

463
00:33:36.039 --> 00:33:39.920
least say post World War two, I would even say

464
00:33:39.960 --> 00:33:42.039
post World War one president.

465
00:33:43.799 --> 00:33:46.160
And it's interesting because he strikes so many people as

466
00:33:46.200 --> 00:33:48.079
a kind of a conoclass with the way that he

467
00:33:48.160 --> 00:33:50.960
just walks in and says things that people think he's

468
00:33:50.960 --> 00:33:54.480
not supposed to say. You wrote that it was Trump's

469
00:33:54.680 --> 00:33:58.119
content in twenty sixteen that America had lost his way,

470
00:33:58.640 --> 00:34:00.640
and it was that that point of view that tipped

471
00:34:00.640 --> 00:34:03.559
the election in his favor. You're going to write that

472
00:34:03.599 --> 00:34:08.280
he delivered the most daring inauguration address since Andrew Jackson.

473
00:34:08.840 --> 00:34:11.119
That was telling, how how do you?

474
00:34:11.519 --> 00:34:12.800
How? So did that happen?

475
00:34:13.840 --> 00:34:18.679
No, Because if you close your eyes and recalled the

476
00:34:19.119 --> 00:34:24.440
scenery itself, there there was Trump. He had won the

477
00:34:24.480 --> 00:34:28.599
election against all the money and the media that the

478
00:34:28.639 --> 00:34:33.920
American elite could could muster. And behind him sat Stone

479
00:34:34.000 --> 00:34:39.079
faced the Clinton's and the Bushes and all the representatives

480
00:34:39.159 --> 00:34:45.039
of of the the boosted elite, so to speak, and

481
00:34:44.800 --> 00:34:51.039
that they were very pale. He gave his speech. If

482
00:34:51.079 --> 00:34:55.360
you read it and compare it, I've actually read every

483
00:34:55.800 --> 00:35:02.199
inauguration speech since the eighteen eight is onwards. Wow, there

484
00:35:02.320 --> 00:35:07.400
is nothing that stands out being so firm and being

485
00:35:07.440 --> 00:35:11.920
so clear and in the positive meaning of the word aggressive,

486
00:35:12.800 --> 00:35:16.639
meaning forward looking at now we're here to do the

487
00:35:16.760 --> 00:35:23.719
people's work. That the Trump's first in augurall from twenty seventeen,

488
00:35:24.880 --> 00:35:31.480
not even Ragan, he came close, but Trump went even further.

489
00:35:32.400 --> 00:35:34.719
You know, I was thinking back to nineteen ninety two

490
00:35:36.320 --> 00:35:39.719
between George W. Hw Bush and Bill Clinton, and then

491
00:35:39.840 --> 00:35:42.840
Ross Parraut was in the mix, if you recall, and

492
00:35:43.159 --> 00:35:46.440
Bill Buckley mentioned that ross Parraut was kind of the

493
00:35:46.639 --> 00:35:49.599
up yours vote when you're not happy with either one

494
00:35:49.599 --> 00:35:51.320
of them, this is the populace. But he was like,

495
00:35:51.880 --> 00:35:53.119
your way to stick it to the man was the

496
00:35:53.199 --> 00:35:55.119
vote for ross Parrau. Is that was that what Donald

497
00:35:55.159 --> 00:35:56.400
Trump has become in a sense?

498
00:35:57.920 --> 00:36:03.880
Yes, he was then a mature verse and so to speak,

499
00:36:04.039 --> 00:36:09.840
politically mature version of ros Perol. He was. He came

500
00:36:09.880 --> 00:36:15.280
from the outside. What Trump did was smarter than rose

501
00:36:15.360 --> 00:36:18.880
Parol was that he didn't try to start his own

502
00:36:19.239 --> 00:36:23.280
third part because that's always a political kiss of death

503
00:36:23.360 --> 00:36:28.519
in this country. So he Trump was smart enough to

504
00:36:28.559 --> 00:36:34.159
get into one of the parties and win its primaries.

505
00:36:35.760 --> 00:36:39.000
It's possible that parole would have had one already in

506
00:36:39.119 --> 00:36:41.679
ninety two or ninety six if he has done that.

507
00:36:41.719 --> 00:36:45.280
But I don't think it was not gone for enough.

508
00:36:47.159 --> 00:36:50.239
We only saw the beginning of all the problems we

509
00:36:50.320 --> 00:36:59.159
have now with mass illegal immigration, the deficit, the national death,

510
00:36:59.800 --> 00:37:07.119
the lawlessness, and this walk ideology was only in its diapers, right,

511
00:37:09.159 --> 00:37:14.400
but everything the coming twenty years, all of that came

512
00:37:14.519 --> 00:37:19.239
into into full bloom, and then the American people said

513
00:37:19.400 --> 00:37:24.280
enough is enough and voted for the guy who promised

514
00:37:24.320 --> 00:37:24.840
to stop it.

515
00:37:25.119 --> 00:37:27.239
Right and getting back to Trump, you made a point

516
00:37:27.239 --> 00:37:28.800
that I want to explore a little bit. You said

517
00:37:28.840 --> 00:37:32.800
that Trump's foreign policy didn't sit well with anyone except

518
00:37:32.880 --> 00:37:33.960
the American people.

519
00:37:35.079 --> 00:37:35.760
Why was that?

520
00:37:37.079 --> 00:37:43.440
Well? That was if a big active federal government is

521
00:37:43.519 --> 00:37:50.519
the heart or the core of domestic progressivism, a big active,

522
00:37:50.800 --> 00:37:56.880
or at least aggressive and strong for federal government is

523
00:37:56.920 --> 00:38:01.320
the core of the new Conservatives will view because they

524
00:38:01.800 --> 00:38:05.280
just like with the Spanish American War, they think it's

525
00:38:05.320 --> 00:38:10.119
America as religious or at least civil duty to send

526
00:38:10.639 --> 00:38:17.960
American troops across the globe and introduce freedom everywhere. Iraq

527
00:38:18.400 --> 00:38:27.360
Afghanist down, we will all hate hated Puerto Rico wherever

528
00:38:27.599 --> 00:38:30.519
I think we have invaded like thirty five countries since

529
00:38:30.599 --> 00:38:34.880
nineteen acred or something like that, and always under this send, oh,

530
00:38:35.119 --> 00:38:36.920
we will go there to do it better for them.

531
00:38:36.960 --> 00:38:39.639
So it's not again, it's not an evil thing, but

532
00:38:39.760 --> 00:38:40.960
it just doesn't work.

533
00:38:41.239 --> 00:38:44.519
It's naive, I guess, because not all. Some cultures are

534
00:38:44.519 --> 00:38:49.519
antithetical to our values and they don't always reciprocate our generosity.

535
00:38:49.599 --> 00:38:55.519
Right, no, you take I mean the living laboratory for

536
00:38:56.119 --> 00:39:00.000
Western style freedom was Europe after the fall of communists.

537
00:39:01.800 --> 00:39:05.239
Communism fell within what was it a three year period

538
00:39:05.679 --> 00:39:11.239
from Moscow to Berlin, and the countries who had a

539
00:39:11.400 --> 00:39:19.039
Western cultural heritage, a Protestant Catholic heritage, with power divisions

540
00:39:19.719 --> 00:39:24.559
and stuff like that, they have all become more or

541
00:39:24.679 --> 00:39:33.079
less well functioning democracies. In the more eastern countries Russia, Ukraine, Belarus,

542
00:39:34.559 --> 00:39:40.400
the Central Asian states who had a much more dark

543
00:39:40.719 --> 00:39:48.360
from our perspective, cultural heritage of autocratic rulers stars absolutely

544
00:39:48.440 --> 00:39:53.239
no democratic traditions to fall back on, democracy came and

545
00:39:53.280 --> 00:39:57.599
went within a decade more or less. Ukraine is somewhere

546
00:39:57.920 --> 00:40:02.719
on the middle there because it's half older historically, but

547
00:40:02.880 --> 00:40:10.719
Russia went tried. The Russian people was offered a bucket

548
00:40:10.800 --> 00:40:14.480
of freedom and hypocrisy. They tasted it and said it

549
00:40:14.519 --> 00:40:18.360
probably tastes good, but it's not ours, and then they

550
00:40:20.719 --> 00:40:22.719
have supported ever since.

551
00:40:23.119 --> 00:40:28.760
Yeah, yeah, Now I understand why the left so despised

552
00:40:28.800 --> 00:40:32.360
as President Trump. They now generally despise anyone who's to

553
00:40:32.360 --> 00:40:35.760
the right of Linen. But to what do you attribute

554
00:40:35.840 --> 00:40:39.760
the antagonism from certain quarters of the right toward Trump.

555
00:40:40.079 --> 00:40:42.719
Bill Buckley used refer to them as the well fed right.

556
00:40:42.840 --> 00:40:45.639
But what exactly got their knickers and a bunch about Trump?

557
00:40:47.000 --> 00:40:50.079
Yeah, his enemies on the right are mostly the so

558
00:40:50.239 --> 00:40:54.639
called neocoms, because he don't want to continue their aggressive

559
00:40:54.679 --> 00:40:59.480
foreign policy. As we have talked about. They live in

560
00:41:00.199 --> 00:41:04.960
someone has called New CON's right wing liberals because they

561
00:41:05.079 --> 00:41:09.199
think that you can change everything with politics and it's

562
00:41:09.280 --> 00:41:15.599
only one one system, the Western liberal democracy, that that

563
00:41:15.679 --> 00:41:22.000
should be allowed to exist. Then I also think it's

564
00:41:22.039 --> 00:41:28.960
a social cultural resistance amongst certain If you take your

565
00:41:29.159 --> 00:41:36.199
archetypical snobbish mid Romney kind of country club Republican, Trump

566
00:41:36.320 --> 00:41:41.719
is way too square. He he swares too much, He

567
00:41:43.800 --> 00:41:48.719
he craigs dirty jokes and all this kind of stuff

568
00:41:48.800 --> 00:41:52.119
that you don't you don't do in public in certain

569
00:41:52.639 --> 00:41:57.800
upper circles in the in the Northeast at least. So

570
00:41:57.840 --> 00:42:04.039
that's also but it's different his resistance to an aggressive

571
00:42:04.119 --> 00:42:08.719
foreign policy, and also to some extent to his view

572
00:42:09.280 --> 00:42:15.960
on tolls and tariffs. Okay, because the American writers became fundamental,

573
00:42:16.679 --> 00:42:22.800
tournamentalistic believers in so called free trade, which is not

574
00:42:23.079 --> 00:42:26.559
very free if you ask me, it kind of advanced

575
00:42:26.559 --> 00:42:27.719
to the foreign aid.

576
00:42:30.039 --> 00:42:32.679
I want to change topics just the last couple of

577
00:42:32.760 --> 00:42:35.400
questions here, but you note that, thanks to the vitriol

578
00:42:35.679 --> 00:42:40.519
and supersized grievances of various groups that based themselves on sex, race,

579
00:42:40.679 --> 00:42:44.079
myriad gender identities, et cetera, that we now suffer under

580
00:42:44.079 --> 00:42:47.239
what you call a minoritarian tyranny. Nice term, by the way,

581
00:42:47.280 --> 00:42:50.599
I like that. Is there any remedy or are any

582
00:42:50.639 --> 00:42:55.119
way to tamp down the insanity of the identitarian politics

583
00:42:55.159 --> 00:42:58.280
that we see just flaring up all around us?

584
00:42:59.719 --> 00:43:08.519
I would recommend two remedies for this, two pills to

585
00:43:08.599 --> 00:43:14.400
swallow the first and there we can all participate. You

586
00:43:14.559 --> 00:43:19.519
just start laughing them in their face. These people have said,

587
00:43:19.599 --> 00:43:23.519
there's fifty seven genders and there's no difference between boys

588
00:43:23.559 --> 00:43:28.440
and girls from birth. You just tell people, are you

589
00:43:28.559 --> 00:43:36.519
absolutely nuts? Because they don't dissert. No, But you should

590
00:43:36.599 --> 00:43:41.880
always try to respect your opponents and their views. But

591
00:43:42.079 --> 00:43:45.519
there is a line in the sand beyond where it's

592
00:43:46.519 --> 00:43:51.639
turns into absolutely absolute stupidity, and the modern left has

593
00:43:51.719 --> 00:43:55.480
paused that on many many fields. The other big thing,

594
00:43:55.559 --> 00:43:58.880
and that's what I hope if things goes as they

595
00:43:58.920 --> 00:44:03.280
look they are going next Tuesday and Trump comes back,

596
00:44:04.639 --> 00:44:08.679
what the second Trump administration can and should do is

597
00:44:08.719 --> 00:44:13.400
to cut the funding. Because this is a small to

598
00:44:13.480 --> 00:44:22.559
a very large extent tax funded elite. They get some

599
00:44:22.800 --> 00:44:25.840
millions from your sorrow the your sorrows of the worlds,

600
00:44:25.840 --> 00:44:29.719
but most of them are on either federal or state

601
00:44:30.039 --> 00:44:31.920
or or even local.

602
00:44:33.320 --> 00:44:34.280
Pay.

603
00:44:35.199 --> 00:44:42.360
Cut the funding to these, takeaway the DEEI divisions, and

604
00:44:42.360 --> 00:44:48.559
and and stop giving money to progressive art works and

605
00:44:48.599 --> 00:44:55.079
all this, and also a simple thing that the federal

606
00:44:55.119 --> 00:44:59.119
government could do. I don't think that the federal government

607
00:44:59.159 --> 00:45:06.360
should should continue to found higher education at all, but

608
00:45:06.440 --> 00:45:09.880
as long as they do it, they can't put that

609
00:45:11.880 --> 00:45:18.360
on the tag. If your university want federal funding, and

610
00:45:18.440 --> 00:45:23.440
let the students get federal student loans get to read

611
00:45:23.480 --> 00:45:23.719
of this.

612
00:45:24.559 --> 00:45:27.000
Yeah, yeah, no, I get it.

613
00:45:27.360 --> 00:45:29.840
And that both of the things that you talk about

614
00:45:29.920 --> 00:45:33.880
would would defang the gatekeepers that you described. It would

615
00:45:33.920 --> 00:45:35.960
kind of take away the fuel and the juice that

616
00:45:36.039 --> 00:45:37.599
allows them to continue the madness.

617
00:45:39.159 --> 00:45:41.400
Yeah, because, as I said, they are to a large

618
00:45:41.519 --> 00:45:45.760
extent directly or indirectly living on the taxpayers.

619
00:45:47.360 --> 00:45:53.360
Dine right, right, last last question, You're right that if

620
00:45:53.519 --> 00:45:57.360
if national and patriotic identities continue to fade, the only

621
00:45:57.440 --> 00:46:00.880
unifying force left throughout the West will soon be the

622
00:46:01.000 --> 00:46:06.199
visible cold hand, an army booted foot of government unquote.

623
00:46:07.559 --> 00:46:09.800
In what direction do you see the trend line moving

624
00:46:09.840 --> 00:46:12.079
in the West in general and American particular.

625
00:46:12.280 --> 00:46:13.800
I mean, is it possible to.

626
00:46:15.639 --> 00:46:17.880
Be going toward the cold hand or is it possible

627
00:46:17.920 --> 00:46:20.559
to replace the cold hand with the invisible hand.

628
00:46:20.320 --> 00:46:22.440
Of free markets and free people. Where do you see

629
00:46:22.440 --> 00:46:23.039
the trend going?

630
00:46:24.360 --> 00:46:27.320
Yeah, the trend has for the last ten twenty years

631
00:46:27.440 --> 00:46:33.880
especially been towards the cold, dead hand of government because

632
00:46:34.119 --> 00:46:40.599
all these censorship initiatives here in the US, it was

633
00:46:40.639 --> 00:46:49.199
the Biden administrations cahooting with MITA and the old Twitter

634
00:46:49.960 --> 00:46:54.559
about censorship and stuff like that. In Europe, there of course,

635
00:46:54.840 --> 00:47:01.360
going even further, the EU is trying to basic invert

636
00:47:01.840 --> 00:47:06.360
the whole principle of freedom of speech as I understand it,

637
00:47:06.440 --> 00:47:09.519
because freedom of speech should be freedom of speech in

638
00:47:09.599 --> 00:47:12.840
the meaning that you can say whatever you want as

639
00:47:12.840 --> 00:47:18.280
long as it's not forbidden like for the espionnation and defamation.

640
00:47:19.599 --> 00:47:22.079
But as I understand it, what the EU wants to

641
00:47:22.119 --> 00:47:25.960
do now is effectively to say you can't say anything

642
00:47:26.039 --> 00:47:27.679
if we haven't said that, it's.

643
00:47:27.519 --> 00:47:31.159
Okay, right, right right, because that's.

644
00:47:31.440 --> 00:47:34.079
I mean, then it's over. If they get pushed that

645
00:47:34.280 --> 00:47:38.360
through and implement it, then democracies is gone in.

646
00:47:38.360 --> 00:47:40.679
Europe, and it can happen so quickly.

647
00:47:40.719 --> 00:47:43.880
Since the American left since over one hundred years, loved

648
00:47:43.960 --> 00:47:48.440
everything the European left and copying all everything the European

649
00:47:48.519 --> 00:47:51.519
left is doing, they will do the same thing here.

650
00:47:51.559 --> 00:47:54.199
And we have already seen it. Harris has said that

651
00:47:54.239 --> 00:47:58.880
you shouldn't be able to say whatever you want online

652
00:47:59.039 --> 00:48:03.880
and stuff like that. So it comes creeping if we

653
00:48:03.920 --> 00:48:08.800
are not putting down our sheet and say enough is enough,

654
00:48:09.559 --> 00:48:14.639
that the First Amendment is absolute, except for as I said, espionn.

655
00:48:14.360 --> 00:48:19.119
Orshan, Yeah, it comes, it comes slowly. It kind of creeps,

656
00:48:19.159 --> 00:48:20.920
as you say, and then one day it happens all

657
00:48:20.960 --> 00:48:23.400
at once. It just is very decisive and quick at

658
00:48:23.400 --> 00:48:23.760
the end.

659
00:48:24.519 --> 00:48:30.719
Mm hmm. Yeah, it's it's like a guy already well

660
00:48:31.079 --> 00:48:35.440
uh well loaded, on his way home from a boar,

661
00:48:36.039 --> 00:48:40.079
drinking from from a bottles. Suddenly he just turned around

662
00:48:40.119 --> 00:48:44.119
and he doesn't know how where he is ended up there.

663
00:48:44.760 --> 00:48:51.760
That that's how Totalitranism often calme. It very seldom comes

664
00:48:53.039 --> 00:48:56.159
through a revolution or something. It comes creeping up on

665
00:48:56.320 --> 00:48:57.719
societies and people.

666
00:48:59.239 --> 00:48:59.599
Folks.

667
00:49:00.280 --> 00:49:04.480
I've only skimmed the surface of this amazing book. It's

668
00:49:04.519 --> 00:49:06.320
a feast for the mind and the spirit, and I

669
00:49:06.440 --> 00:49:08.960
highly recommend it to our listeners. The book is called

670
00:49:09.280 --> 00:49:14.400
Radical Betrayal, How Liberals Neo Conservatives are Wrecking American Exceptionalism.

671
00:49:14.440 --> 00:49:16.639
Published by Defiance Press and Publishing.

672
00:49:17.159 --> 00:49:20.320
It is very much worth your time to read, Doctor

673
00:49:20.400 --> 00:49:21.119
anders W.

674
00:49:21.280 --> 00:49:26.280
Edwardson. It's been a pleasure. He very much enjoyed it.

675
00:49:26.360 --> 00:49:29.639
Thank you again for being on the program today, folks,

676
00:49:29.719 --> 00:49:34.880
as doctor Andrews W. Edwardson on the Dave Carter Program. Well,

677
00:49:34.920 --> 00:49:37.480
now that's something to think about, a few things to

678
00:49:37.559 --> 00:49:39.880
chew on, something to take to heart.

679
00:49:40.199 --> 00:50:05.199
Exactly what I'm going to do. How about you all

680
00:50:05.280 --> 00:50:09.719
right now? I mean, doctor Edwardson was pretty amazing, wasn't he.

681
00:50:10.559 --> 00:50:12.960
It's I mean, I don't mean to sound territorial here,

682
00:50:13.000 --> 00:50:17.679
but this gentleman is from Sweden, and he's probably forgotten

683
00:50:17.760 --> 00:50:19.800
much more about American history than a lot of other

684
00:50:19.840 --> 00:50:20.960
Americans will ever know.

685
00:50:25.239 --> 00:50:26.000
This book is.

686
00:50:27.880 --> 00:50:31.239
Very well written, wonderfully researched. It's compelling and a very

687
00:50:31.280 --> 00:50:34.599
interesting read. I remember reading a Dorothy Parker interview a

688
00:50:34.920 --> 00:50:37.079
review of a book once, and it was a book

689
00:50:37.159 --> 00:50:38.840
she didn't like all that much, and he said that

690
00:50:39.039 --> 00:50:41.039
she said that that particular book should not be tossed

691
00:50:41.039 --> 00:50:44.800
aside lightly. She said it should be thrown with great force.

692
00:50:46.119 --> 00:50:47.960
I'll tell you, you get your hands on this book by

693
00:50:47.960 --> 00:50:51.239
doctor Edwardson, Radical Betrayal, and you won't want to put

694
00:50:51.239 --> 00:50:51.639
it down.

695
00:50:52.079 --> 00:50:52.320
Ever.

696
00:50:53.239 --> 00:50:55.519
My wife and I take a little time every evening

697
00:50:56.039 --> 00:50:59.840
where we actually turn off the TV, turn on some music,

698
00:51:00.440 --> 00:51:04.079
and read our books. Usually it's an hour to an

699
00:51:04.119 --> 00:51:05.559
hour and a half or so that we spend on

700
00:51:05.599 --> 00:51:09.239
the couch reading. I had a tough time putting doctor

701
00:51:09.360 --> 00:51:12.320
Edwardson's book down, and I just know you're going to

702
00:51:12.320 --> 00:51:15.280
love that book. To death, So take a look at

703
00:51:15.280 --> 00:51:19.159
it Radical Betrayal, and I hope you've enjoyed the show today. Now,

704
00:51:19.199 --> 00:51:21.159
before I get out of here, let me remind you

705
00:51:21.400 --> 00:51:24.239
of a place where you can have all the access

706
00:51:24.320 --> 00:51:28.000
to all the podcasts I've ever done on one digital player,

707
00:51:28.159 --> 00:51:30.239
mind you, along with all with many of the articles

708
00:51:30.280 --> 00:51:32.440
that I've done and my own research sources. And it's

709
00:51:32.480 --> 00:51:35.960
that over at Dave Carter online dot Notion dot site.

710
00:51:36.519 --> 00:51:39.039
Dave Carter online, dot Notion dot site.

711
00:51:39.119 --> 00:51:39.800
S I T E.

712
00:51:40.280 --> 00:51:41.760
And I'll link to it on the page where you

713
00:51:41.800 --> 00:51:45.639
can find the day's interview with doctor Edwardson. Also coming

714
00:51:45.719 --> 00:51:48.480
up in just a few short weeks here, I'll be

715
00:51:48.559 --> 00:51:51.840
joining up with Talk Radio extraordinary Brian Rust, who has

716
00:51:51.880 --> 00:51:55.239
been on this program quite a few times. Brian and

717
00:51:55.840 --> 00:51:58.840
Brian and I are going to do a joint episode

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of this show and his show in front of a

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live audience on Panama City Beach, Florida, and we're hammering

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out the details now on what should be an awesome venue.

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And we're going to decompress a little bit at the

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show and have some post election funds, so you won't

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want to miss out on that, Remember, folks, a lot

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is writing on what happens in just a few short days.

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There's a yawning chasm between misery and prosperity, between between

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peace and war, and between freedom of speech and speech police.

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So standing on the sidelines doing your ponscious pilot routine

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isn't going to cut it this time. It's time to

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act for you, your children and their children. With sincere thanks

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and gratitude to doctor enders W. Edwardson and as always

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always my profound thanks to you the listener. I am

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Dave Carter and I'll see you next time.

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Thank you for listening to the Dave counter Show. Don't

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forget to subscribe on issues, so you won't.

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00:53:00.039 --> 00:53:02.760
It's a single episode, and while you're there, please leave

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a review and tell us what you think.

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00:53:04.920 --> 00:53:07.039
And on behalf of all of us at the Dave

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Carter Show and the Ricochet Audio Network. Thank you for listening.